Acoustic Research 30th Anniversary Limited Edition AR9LS; Interesting ?

[lance G]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/233844785096?ul_noapp=true

Interesting item, Interesting comments from anyone please !

Looks like they are still available at the time of writing.

Time for someone to wake up in the U.S.A. ?!

[AR surround]

Thanks for bringing this to our attention .  One has to wonder how those domes get pushed in.  It must be the handiwork of young fingers.   The water damage doesn't look too bad...It doesn't seem like it was in a flood, but closer inspection is probably necessary.   This guy isn't far from me, but with AR9's, AR90's, and AR91s in the house, I don't have the space.

[lance G]

3 hours ago, AR surround said:

Thanks for bringing this to our attention .  One has to wonder how those domes get pushed in.  It must be the handiwork of young fingers.   The water damage doesn't look too bad...It doesn't seem like it was in a flood, but closer inspection is probably necessary.   This guy isn't far from me, but with AR9's, AR90's, and AR91s in the house, I don't have the space.

Seems a shame that these might go to someone who might not do the best with them or even break for parts. I am in the U.K. so with customs/shipping it would not make sense for me. I am lucky enough, particularly in the U.K. to already have a pair of AR9's. I was still tempted to buy/secure them on behalf of someone from this site, and pass on, on a non profit basis. Must be some form of AR fever, or maybe going a bit daft in my old age !

Surely a great Covid restriction project for someone to pass the time with ? If they were in the U.K. I would have grabbed them.

However, still interested in any information on these, as I have not heard of an anniversary edition of same, with these apparently being the 3rd and 4th speaker in the series judging by the serial numbers ? I also see what may be the original boxes in some of the picture backgrounds ?

I hope someone on here hooks them, and follows up with their rebuild experience/s.

[JKent]

3 hours ago, AR surround said:

This guy isn't far from me, but with AR9's, AR90's, and AR91s in the house, I don't have the space.

Yeah--me too. Close. Tempting. But no room here.

[lance G]

My interest has sparked a reduced offer via the "sale site" by the seller. Looks like $230 could currently secure them.

Must be worth a physical look if anyone is local. They do on the face of it seem to be "fairly" priced ?😉. The seller might even be open to some more haggling on the day ?!

 

[JKent]

Still $250 USD or "Make Offer" but those are over 4' high and about 120 lbs each. I'm afraid I'm not even going to look.

[lance G]

1 minute ago, JKent said:

Still $250 USD or "Make Offer" but those are over 4' high and about 120 lbs each. I'm afraid I'm not even going to look.

I thought you had high ceilings in the U.S.A. ? You could stack them on top of you 9's !

[JKent]

Looks like a CSP member got them. I know they're in good hands.

[lance G]

41 minutes ago, JKent said:

Looks like a CSP member got them. I know they're in good hands.

Excellent news !

I hope they let us know the outcome of their purchase, both in the short and long term.

These things can be a gamble, but again, on the face of things, these seemed to be reasonable bet.

 

[AR surround]

19 hours ago, JKent said:

Still $250 USD or "Make Offer" but those are over 4' high and about 120 lbs each. I'm afraid I'm not even going to look.

Yeah, the tech part of my brain told me that a restoration was doable.  The financial part of my brain said that the cost might justify the results.  But my back said...no way!  LOL

[harry398]

Thats an interesting pair.

9LS special edition, sure looks like a 9 LSI....however the wood veneer is different.

I dont know who the csp person is....but those need Alot of work.

If done right, they will be incredible speakers.   And I mean Incredible.

[lance G]

11 hours ago, harry398 said:

Thats an interesting pair.

9LS special edition, sure looks like a 9 LSI....however the wood veneer is different.

I dont know who the csp person is....but those need Alot of work.

If done right, they will be incredible speakers.   And I mean Incredible.

I am really hoping that there will be some follow up on these. I have personally never seen or heard of such beasts, and there is little (if any ?) result from an internet search. Hopefully someone with some prior experience/knowledge will chip in. If in truth it is a site member that has procured these, please relieve me/us of some of my/our sense of intrigue with an update !

The grain in the veneer, hopefully real wood and not a plastic wrap of some sort, appears to be matched, and what I think would be the usual front decal describing/illustrating the various drivers is also absent. Other than the drivers, cosmetically they appear to be in a sound, possibly good or when closely studying the pictures even great condition considering their age ? The grille covers seem to be relatively unfaded ? Perhaps as a result of being stored in the original shipping boxes ?

Hopefully they were put away in the boxes as a consequence of driver foam rot, and have survived relatively unscathed ? The depressed midrange, and any other domes can likely be teased back into shape ?

An intriguing pair of speakers, and it would out of interest be (to me) fascinating to be made aware of the motive/s behind their initial build/provenance.

An out there (and possibly sacriligious !) scenario, but if all the drivers were exchanged from an existing working set of speakers, and the crossovers rebuilt, it should result in a somewhat unique set of speakers ?

And finally, who is/was David Lentz ?!!!!!

[genek]

That would be the customer who originally ordered them.

[lance G]

Just now, genek said:

That would be the customer who originally ordered them.

But who is/was he ?

[Chris1this1]

Well gentlemen, this is my first Teledyne era AR full venture, other than repairs on later drivers etc. Being tipped off down at least a three link chain of CSP folks, I didn’t want to miss out on this opportunity.  
 

When they arrived home, my first impressions, is that the woodwork is stunning. Very minor raised spots on the tops, which should be able to be ironed out flat, as well as those water rings should wipe right off with a good cleaner. it’s evident the veneer has been protected with a satin poly from the factory. I’m not too familiar with different wood types, so I wouldn’t really know what type of veneer this is, but I can say the care taken to matchbook the speaker panels is nothing less than impressive. 
 

Electronically, well I could’ve done better but at the moment, I am at where the best case scenario would’ve taken me, i.e. just foam replacements. When initially tested, I noted that both 8 inch LMR drivers were dead, as well as both tweeters, along with one UMR sounding surprisingly like a tweeter. 
 

First things first, I removed the dome assemblies and noted both were wired very differently to each other, and they were also factory service replacements. referencing the schematic I noted that one of them had the tweeter and the mid domes wires crossed with each other, that would explain the one mid sounding funny. Disassembling the units, I noted that both tweeter leads were separated from the terminals, and only one had continuity at the leads. In my parts stash, I had a pair of spare tweeter diaphragms from a salvaged set of AR58 mid/tweeter plates. I pulled the old diaphragms out and noted lots of crusty ferrofluid, So naturally I cleaned it all out, added new ferrofluid as well as the transplant diaphragms. While I was in there, I was able to blow some compressed air through the sides of the assembly to pop out the mid domes. 
 

Next course of action was to figure out why the 8” LMR’s were both dead. Open circuit at the terminals, so A full disassembly was necessary. What a mess, the cone was separating from the voice coil, and I suppose that fatigue stressed the coil leads from the voice coil to the cone causing them to open. Luckily this was repairable, so that is what I did. In the interim, before I investigated this I was browsing the bay, and on a whim purchased a pair of these drivers just in case the repair effort would be unsuccessful, so now I have spares.

So now, just dealing with refoams. Having the 8 inchers completely disassembled simplified a rear of the cone attached foam effort. The 10 inchers were a different story. The spiders had some sagging due to the inverted mounting position and probably no foam for a long time. The simple solution was to adhere the new foam to the front of the cone, this very minor modification now allows the normal position of the coil to be in its intended location. Lastly, awaiting a set of foams for the 12’s. Next is to source new foam for the bass box.
 

Also on order, or a full set of NPE’s, and for experimentation, poly films for the mids/ tweeter circuits as well as resistors for the LSi mod. At first everything will be factory configuration with NPE’s, as originally loaded. and then I could toy with the pollys and resistors. 
 

and now, some photos! 

[lance G]

Absolutely brilliant !

I am so glad that you got these, from what I have seen of your prior experience with other AR speakers, the right man ended up with them and will do them justice. They do appear to be somewhat different from the norm.

Do please keep me/us up to date with your progress and your opinion/s when they are done. I believe it is a step outside what you usually deal with, I hope the change in experience will prove to be a good one. You were obviously keen to get stuck in !

I don't know how relatively unique these may prove to be, hopefully some of the old sages will provide some answers ?

Hopefully I also contributed in bringing them to your attention ?

I await further progress reports !

 

 

[frankmarsi]

I’m glad it was you instead of some prodding clod.

On the other hand, it was almost me as that price was worth the chance and they were about an hour away and my truck was already warmed up.

I viewed your fotos before reading your text and immediately I noticed that you went after the domes first. It figures you would, you being the dome salvaging sort of guy that you are. Must be some deeply rooted breast affliction from your past, I don’t know. Nonetheless, I know you’ll turn out a fully functioning cabinet. Properly set-up In the right room, I’ll bet they’ll sound wonderful.

Funny thing was that I’ve always wondered about this model all these years and they would’ve been a fun project but, the room to work, their use and set-up of just one more system and a bit more than a stretch for me as I have more than I can realistically use. 

[Stimpy]

It's awesome to hear you acquired these Chris.  A perfect fit, considering what needs to be done.  And even more impressive, how much you've already accomplished.

Also, my AR58S speakers had Unicon capacitors, like your 9LS speakers.  For stock, they still sounded very good.  In fact, better than the new M.D.L. electrolytics I tried, in a recap.  I had to go to poly caps, for all the series values, in order to hear an improvement.

Good luck.

[harry398]

17 hours ago, Chris1this1 said:

Well gentlemen, this is my first Teledyne era AR full venture, other than repairs on later drivers etc. Being tipped off down at least a three link chain of CSP folks, I didn’t want to miss out on this opportunity.  
 

When they arrived home, my first impressions, is that the woodwork is stunning. Very minor raised spots on the tops, which should be able to be ironed out flat, as well as those water rings should wipe right off with a good cleaner. it’s evident the veneer has been protected with a satin poly from the factory. I’m not too familiar with different wood types, so I wouldn’t really know what type of veneer this is, but I can say the care taken to matchbook the speaker panels is nothing less than impressive. 
 

Electronically, well I could’ve done better but at the moment, I am at where the best case scenario would’ve taken me, i.e. just foam replacements. When initially tested, I noted that both 8 inch LMR drivers were dead, as well as both tweeters, along with one UMR sounding surprisingly like a tweeter. 
 

First things first, I removed the dome assemblies and noted both were wired very differently to each other, and they were also factory service replacements. referencing the schematic I noted that one of them had the tweeter and the mid domes wires crossed with each other, that would explain the one mid sounding funny. Disassembling the units, I noted that both tweeter leads were separated from the terminals, and only one had continuity at the leads. In my parts stash, I had a pair of spare tweeter diaphragms from a salvaged set of AR58 mid/tweeter plates. I pulled the old diaphragms out and noted lots of crusty ferrofluid, So naturally I cleaned it all out, added new ferrofluid as well as the transplant diaphragms. While I was in there, I was able to blow some compressed air through the sides of the assembly to pop out the mid domes. 
 

Next course of action was to figure out why the 8” LMR’s were both dead. Open circuit at the terminals, so A full disassembly was necessary. What a mess, the cone was separating from the voice coil, and I suppose that fatigue stressed the coil leads from the voice coil to the cone causing them to open. Luckily this was repairable, so that is what I did. In the interim, before I investigated this I was browsing the bay, and on a whim purchased a pair of these drivers just in case the repair effort would be unsuccessful, so now I have spares.

So now, just dealing with refoams. Having the 8 inchers completely disassembled simplified a rear of the cone attached foam effort. The 10 inchers were a different story. The spiders had some sagging due to the inverted mounting position and probably no foam for a long time. The simple solution was to adhere the new foam to the front of the cone, this very minor modification now allows the normal position of the coil to be in its intended location. Lastly, awaiting a set of foams for the 12’s. Next is to source new foam for the bass box.
 

Also on order, or a full set of NPE’s, and for experimentation, poly films for the mids/ tweeter circuits as well as resistors for the LSi mod. At first everything will be factory configuration with NPE’s, as originally loaded. and then I could toy with the pollys and resistors. 
 

and now, some photos! 

well....Chris......congrads......nice grab.

Prepare yourself for some ground shaking Bass, that is very detailed.  

The wide soundstage these produce is unmatched in all the AR's I have owned, and the tweeter and its circuit is sweet.  Its not quite as sterile as the AR9, but its very pleasing and warm. 

The LS series is underrated due to the mid dome being too  strong....since they didnt have switches people shunned them I guess.   Takes some experimentation to get it right for the room-and taste.   

You may find the Mid dome circuit needs a little calming, you may want to experiment with some resistors.... and I think your on the right track with NPE caps.   Originals arent too bad, Japan.   

I know these inside out and Only thing I am curious is if they will outperform the LST in terms of Soundstage in YOUR opinion.   The LST with its side panels...interesting.   The rest I already know.

I run a set of ar9ls in the garage too...original caps....pretty good.   superior to those silly yellow turds from Erse.

 

[Chris1this1]

20 hours ago, Stimpy said:

It's awesome to hear you acquired these Chris.  A perfect fit, considering what needs to be done.  And even more impressive, how much you've already accomplished.

Also, my AR58S speakers had Unicon capacitors, like you 9LS speakers.  For stock, they still sounded very good.  In fact, better than the new M.D.L. electrolytics I tried, in a recap.  I had to go to poly caps, for all the series values, in order to hear an improvement.

Good luck.

Stimpy, 

That is a really interesting observation about the new NPE's not sounding as good as the originals. So I was going to add a non-invasive switch to enable or disable the LSi mod, but now I'll add another switch, to switch between the series NPE's or series poly's. Both switches will be added to the connection cutout, over the input binding posts. I'll measure the values of the original caps when this work happens, and if they are still within tolerance, i'll leave the Unicons in place, and just have the pollys as switched option B. 

8 hours ago, harry398 said:

well....Chris......congrads......nice grab.

Prepare yourself for some ground shaking Bass, that is very detailed.  

The wide soundstage these produce is unmatched in all the AR's I have owned, and the tweeter and its circuit is sweet.  Its not quite as sterile as the AR9, but its very pleasing and warm. 

The LS series is underrated due to the mid dome being too  strong....since they didnt have switches people shunned them I guess.   Takes some experimentation to get it right for the room-and taste.   

You may find the Mid dome circuit needs a little calming, you may want to experiment with some resistors.... and I think your on the right track with NPE caps.   Originals arent too bad, Japan.   

I know these inside out and Only thing I am curious is if they will outperform the LST in terms of Soundstage in YOUR opinion.   The LST with its side panels...interesting.   The rest I already know.

I run a set of ar9ls in the garage too...original caps....pretty good.   superior to those silly yellow turds from Erse.

 

Harry, 

Currently in the room is a pair of AR3's and I absolutely love the forward midrange on those..as dialed in with the pots. These 9ls's will be swapped with the 3's when they are done and hopefully the room won't be too restrictive to their potential. Its essentially an 11'x14' room, with the speakers  to be along the 14' wall. In my opinion, the LST's were oversized in that room but still sounded great, only swapped out for the 3's for a more modest look. The soundstage performance of the LST's vs. the 9ls would be very room dependent/restrictive in my situation, but soon to find out. 

[Stimpy]

3 hours ago, Chris1this1 said:

Stimpy, 

That is a really interesting observation about the new NPE's not sounding as good as the originals. So I was going to add a non-invasive switch to enable or disable the LSi mod, but now I'll add another switch, to switch between the series NPE's or series poly's. Both switches will be added to the connection cutout, over the input binding posts. I'll measure the values of the original caps when this work happens, and if they are still within tolerance, i'll leave the Unicons in place, and just have the pollys as switched option B. 

Hi Chris,

Those switch ideas sound like a good plan.  An extremely easy way to perform instant A/B comparisons.  I'll definitely look forward to your impressions once implemented.

As to my NPE adventures, I tried Bennic and M.D.L.  While they sounded fine, they seemed compressed in nature.  It was like the speakers had lost their dynamics.  Which I really disliked.  As a test, and since I was already using Mundorf poly caps on my 90's, I bought ClarityCaps for the 58's.  Clarity CSA's the the 4uF tweeter cap, and a 24 for the dome mid.  I left the NPE's on the parallel stunts. 

One of the reasons I tried the ClarityCaps, was they exhibit a higher ESR than is typical for a poly.  Closer to a NPE.  I figured the driver balance would stay similar to stock that way.

The ClarityCaps have been great.  Warm and musical, with a wide soundstage.  The Mundorf EVO Oils Ive used, are very transparent, clean and clear.  They present better soundstage depth, and presence.  Both brands very good, depending on the flavor you want?

[AR surround]

17 hours ago, Chris1this1 said:

That is a really interesting observation about the new NPE's not sounding as good as the originals.

Chris,

I second Stimpy's sentiments about the new NPE's not sounding as good as the original Unicon NPE's.   I replaced the Unicons in a pair of Boston Acoustics A70's with new NPE's.  The result was absolutely awful.  I mitigated the issue by adding resistance and F&F bypass caps; but I should have just let the Unicons be.

[AR55]

The exotic wood veneer and plaque definitely make the speakers one of a kind. 

What I find interesting is that a 30^th Anniversary AR9LS has pre-1986 woofers and crossovers.  My guess is that either the woofers and crossovers were NOS, or they were pulled from existing AR-9LS' and put into a new cabinets.  Either way, it’s a great find.  As I have said before, I have found few speakers on the market today that can compete with my 9Lsi’s.

[genek]

Everything in an unmodded 9ls would be pre-1986. The AR9ls was sold from 1982-1985.

AR was founded in 1952. Its 30th anniversary was 1982.

[Steve F]

AR was founded in 1954, not 1952. The few places that say "1952" (I think Wikipedia, an old Cambridge Sound catalog, maybe a few others) are in error.

1954 is the correct date. This is how things get distorted over time. Inexact "facts" are stated and repeated until the real facts are obscured forever.