frankmarsi

2-27-2022 4PM EST O-tay Spanky, I may have met my match and there might be others out there waiting to approach this post. However, this fella has to go some distance yet. First off he’s powering all four per side with what I believe is a mere 200 watts per-side. How ever these speakers are hooked up, it’s going to be a drain on any amplifier so, that amp may not last too long if ‘run hard and put-away wet’ sort of speak. Second of all, they’re on the freak’in floor to boot, who does that? Oh, I think you know who you are. Though at approximately four hundred lbs. per side, those beauties would get the 'plus-size' weight award if nothing else, certainly the 'participation award' for being there. I'm just say-'in. And watching the current News, it appears the whole world may be in a 'all-out, burn-out' mode of super-bad goings on. That room won’t get the award for acoustics and set-up either. I also see cast aside to either side of the room of what look like two Allison 1's, and rightly so as it's a no-contest there. It's also interesting to note that in some circles "M.L." is considered the original promoter/forefather of 'High-End' audio and aptly so. Therefore, it's no surprise he chose the AR-LST's to be his first entrance into offering high-end speakers with his name on it. He later improved the speaker by redesigning the cross-over, eliminated the transformer and using "Dynaudio" speakers in place of AR drivers in the same cabinet but with no wood edge-deflection of the original and, amazingly enough all the while AR was in the death throes of an ugly ending. Just as a matter of record, his ''improved' and last LST model's MSRP was $16,000/pair. as further testament of an original excellent design and sound reproduction being improved. Getting back to matters at hand, at least it’s a wonderful starting point and, I’m impressed by the sheer numbers of LST’s in one room. This may motivate me to go full out nut-job status myself. "AR-surround" watch out, your poking the bear may force it to show its teeth. I have the three pairs I already own and enough substantial power amplifiers so, I need one more pair of LST's. Actually, that's a little crazy as three pairs would be the limit for me considering the ceiling is in the way. If I find another pair of AR-LST’s at a fair price, I’ll win the match. And if so, I'll be the 'weight-unknown', 'parts unknown' the reining heavy-weight champion of the world....................... www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6NkOi499QM P.S. What gets me is the propensity of playing music with echos applied to it on a few new-comer hi-fi sites.The use of 'echo' laden recordings that contain a large amount and do not sound 'real'. Yes, I learned a long time ago that 'echo' laden recordings can and do make the music and henceforth a system sound bigger and more attractive but, it's a cheap cop-out in exaggerating the overall presentation nor do we all live full time in an 'echo-chamber'. It's a newcomer's folly and many wrongfully evaluate their set-ups this way, nutso and oh so wrong and all over A.K. Some folks show-off their set-ups with recordings that contain echo, how unreal and manipulative is that? Their favorite echo laden recording that's played is usually Stevie Ray Vaughan. P.S.II I was lucky enough to briefly meet with mluong303. In 2005 or so he offered for sale two AR 303 tweeters. At that time there were no other tweeters available and certainly no talk of replacements that were offered. I called him at his work place in Manhattan and since I was located close to him, we met on the corner or 34th. St. and 3rd. Ave. It was a little uncomfortable for both him and I but, we gave each other a celebratory masculine bear-hug sort of configuration with much happiness as two proud "AR-LST" owners actually meeting for the first time in my history any way except for the British AR representative I met at "Singer-Sound' for AR's unveiling of their new speaker and preamp and amplifier, right there in the heart of NYC. I offered to take him for a cup of coffee in one of the many coffee shops in that area. He declined as he needed to get back to his job so, I passed him the money in drug deal like fashion and he passed the small box containing the 2 tweeters. I've never used them and are still in the same box he gave me as they'll only fit the 303 speakers but, it was a tweeter challenged moment of desperation. One must understand that at the time, there were no other options so I jumped at them. I should've asked him to see his apartment as I believe he had a huge selection of TOTL AR speakers in ownership. In terms of 'AR-knowledge' he had the most I was aware of at that time. I believe he's moved on with other brands, still I'm not sure. FM 33v https://www.google.com/search?q=mark+Levinson+cello+amati+in+1989&sa=X&hl=en&biw=1779&bih=882&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&vet=1&fir=mRjBDnT2q2iGiM%2CwYroUSRk5APovM%2C_%3BblOdqJGM1E-3OM%2CwYroUSRk5APovM%2C_%3BHk0vUTsqKSAiFM%2CwYroUSRk5APovM%2C_%3BvLZ5udJI7Wb7IM%2CwYroUSRk5APovM%2C_%3BLowkFVBVS1sQlM%2CN75w5ebGtqkWNM%2C_%3B-1uTanlvXvxOoM%2CwYroUSRk5APovM%2C_%3BAo97fkH8U6hqpM%2CwYroUSRk5APovM%2C_%3BzHPfxulJgyt41M%2Cy7EZizijyuohcM%2C_%3Ba25ep4d9EFaj4M%2CwYroUSRk5APovM%2C_%3B1IfLgE7xB7xXSM%2C85p2872icY5IRM%2C_&usg=AI4_-kQgTbVrqrtjcw7NHIDgU0JeNzIIEA&ved=2ahUKEwii6PrC56D2AhWuTt8KHdg6DXIQ9QF6BAgGEAE#imgrc=mRjBDnT2q2iGiM Components I) - Cello ‘Double Amati’ Speakers (four Cello Amati Speaker systems, two per channel): The Cello ‘Double Amati’ Speakers are comprised of two stacked Amati speaker cabinets on each stereo channel, each Double Amati pair is mounted to very rare proprietary Cello Ltd. green granite stands, bolted to wrought iron bars. Only a few such granite stands were produced for Cello. Each stereo channel contains eighteen AR drivers - eight tweeters, eight midrange and two twelve-inch woofers - thirty-six AR drivers in all. Mark Levinson modeled the Cello Amati speaker on the AR company’s LST speaker system, that originally used the same or similar drivers as their AR-3 speaker system. These drivers are the same number and model of AR drivers that Mark Levinson employed in his 7-foot tall flagship Cello Stradivari Grand Master Speaker systems. The Cello Double Amati speakers offered here were rebuilt and restored in 2010 with four new-old-stock (NOS) 12-inch AR woofers, and sixteen NOS AR midrange drivers that were purchased from Mark Levinson in the early 1990s (by M. Luong), drivers that were intended to be used, if needed, as spares, when Cello began using DynAudio drivers to replace the no longer available US manufactured AR drivers. The sixteen tweeters are matched 2010 Tonegen AR replacements. The four AR woofers have new surrounds professionally installed in 2015. Four added crossover capacitors, used to fine-tune the tweeter/midrange crossover points, is installed outside the cabinet for easy access for any future changes or further refinement. The cabinets for the Double Amatis are in excellent condition, with only a few superficial marks and blemishes. The grills are in excellent shape. The granite stands and wrought iron mounting bars are in excellent condition and would only require some stone polish to bring out their full luster and deep rich qualities. Adapted from Cello Ltd. documentation: “Elegant in dimension, the thirty-six AR drivers enable the Double Amatis to move a great quantity of air very quickly, Additionally: Here's a nice and cute 'starter-system' and some system details below if anyone is interested;https://www.ebay.com/itm/174203165959?hash=item288f515d07%3Ag%3AOwQAAOSw4pJeQi6D&nma=true&si=gVkLMZ4oX3n5Bkz%2B1%2F5kD73Kwls%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557 IMAGINE A $45, GRAND DOLLAR SYSTEM WITH FOUR STACKED AR-LST'S. Hello.

2-19-2022 @newandold, thanks for the insights and conveying your experiences. Surely, you must understand that I’ve been an avid vintage-stereo person since just before my components were actually ‘new’. Additionally, that is to say however strong and competent my components are, I wouldn’t subject them to the hard rigors of modern day recording techniques along with the inherent stress and strain of frequency and electronic sounds video would put on them. I was thinking more along the lines of a dedicated high power receiver (did I actually just say that? I probably don’t mean it), to handle the inrush of odd space sounds, explosions or gun fire. Not that I watch movies that include that but, you never know when you have guests over and what they might request. Although i may veer-off my standard beliefs, I do have in my reserve-fleet, six Phase Linear PL-400’s and 3 pairs of AR-3a speakers enough to satisfy the requirements for a 5.1 of even a 7.1 video set-up. There's also the option of using a spare pair of AR-LST's as the front speakers though they demand being against the from wall and would complicate issues regarding video set-up. But, like I said, I rather put the stress and strain on some newer less valuable components than my arsenal of vintage equipment whether or not their ability to handle the rigors of modern day video productions is sustainable. Room wise; the den is 20 X 12.5 feet and has oak flooring. Since the house was built in 1965 it also has that then popular, wood paneling and even though it’s the thicker better quality paneling, I may have to rip it all off and install 3/8” sheet-rock, or install the sheet-rock over the paneling. The room also has as one full wall of the room, a huge fireplace which I haven’t given any thought to as to how to deal with. I could fabricate a panel that would slide in front of it to cover the opening. It’s all still in the planning stages as luckily, I have many options. FM 3.1

Being I'm a traditionalist when it comes to my vintage system and what it is composed of, I don’t have the modern facility to hook-up a sub-woofer or modern-stuff like that. My pre-amp and amp can be considered antiques at this stage and therefore almost frail. I steer away from plug and play stuff because my equipment is from another era and time. I walk into a store and no one there has even the faintest idea of what I may tell those born newbies types. I've tried to describe once or twice while speculatively looking at video equipment and when speaking, I simply get crickets and not a clue facial expression from a younger person. I probably had the same expression when my father attempted to explain what life was like for an immigrant during the great-depression so long ago, so it's all relative, I get that. What I learned 60 years ago is not common sense these days. Nor is common sense so common anymore either. On top of it all, I would never mix a dedicated music-system with a video system, that’s just me as the expression goes and quite rightly so. Additionally, my vintage stuff more than likely would not survive the exaggerated levels in modern movie sound tracks so, I’d have to think modern in any future equipment selections I may make. For such a video I'd bring in my conventional thinking and buy into those 'chip' amps some folks rant about reluctantly although. one of guitar amps is 100RMS watts and class 'D'. Oh my, heaven forbid. I think about a bigger video set-up because I plan on buying a Sony 55-65 inch 4 K TV screen for my den which will also double as my music room and there I will have my guitars, amps, and video stuff. Being a bedroom-player becomes inconvenient after a while. And though I haven’t priced anything out, I understand, I’ll have to spend some money for it to even come close to my strictly audio-system. FM

2-16-2022 8:30PM EST I'll try to keep this short which is usually not like me. @newandold, I too have been thinking about buying a sub-woofer ever since I hooked up a 5 inch sub woofer and sound bar to my new Sony 4K TV, it was very surprising to hear what a little speaker can do. However, I wasn’t listening for purity of tone or, quality of output sound. Embarrassingly enough, I was looking into a 15 or 12 inch “SVS” which is a moderately priced unit. My system drives four AR 12 inch woofers as it is. The sub would add additional bass to the lower regions but, I still have my reservations in terms of the actual hook-up and use. In my late model car I have 12 individual speakers and that includes a sub-woofer, all factory installed as part of the upgrade offered when I bought the car new. It’s a “Sony” system that does sound very good though is relegated to a car’s interior and obviously is deceptive because of that. I struggle with the thought of a sub-woofer and coming from being a electric bass player in my youth and a strong lover of the bass sound whether it be a stand-up bass, electric bass or organ bass notes. I’m not a fan of the exaggerated low frequencies as is found in movies that is added solely for effect. My ear/mind connection rejects that level of falseness immediately after it’s heard or felt though, it is thrilling to hear/feel. Besides, being an avid lover of AR’s bass as being the closest rendition of a natural sounding musical bass, I find it difficult to accept anything false. Excessively heightened or fake bass tones. I leave that to the domain of younger than I generations who have been taken-in by that and other falseness of media. Regarding the topic of power, I must confess I’m done with the false remarks of such quotes of “Mac-watts” or things like, “it tested higher output on the bench” and similar BS. True, some manufacturers say things like this at times in their ads but, the power rating is always implied and plus or minus to stay with-in their designed parameters of manufacture. This does not mean the user will actually recieve the higher potential number upon their purchase. I ask, why do some folks with lower watts say it’s more, are they over-compensating? Secondly, it isn’t the typical vintage system owner here or elsewhere that typically uses high power of let’s say more than 150 to 200 watts RMS per-channel, though some might, the number of users is small, that number isn't considered high in the 21st. century. Case in point; I’ll never forget when in 1974 I went from 60 WPC to 400 WPC on my AR-3a’s. I was introduced to a whole new world of detail, intensity, strength and power of every piece of music I put on my turntable, and to the unknowing or inexperienced; there is nothing like high-power. This is not to say I blast away all the time but, even at moderate listening levels, high power affords like I said, greater detail, depth and space of the recorded piece. I just can't believe I'm declaring the virtues of higher wattage almost half a century later after I first bought into it and have been endorsing high-power since 1974 to all my hi-fi pals. In closing, if one hasn’t delved into very high power amplifier use, you needn’t have to project the possible falsehood of a 60 watt amp bench testing at 75 or 80 watts or a 150 watt amp able to output 175 cause you’re not going to realize it unless you’re using actual technical methods. When I upgraded to 700 WPC there was a change including more cavernous depth and strength but, it wasn't like the world turned upside down, just more of what I was already hearing at 400WPC and that is a certain higher level on its own. FM BELOW: swiped off the web. https://jlaudio.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/217201737-Doubling-Power-vs-Doubling-Output 2.9

1-24-2022 @ lakecat: I too have found the higher I got them...the more I liked the way they sounded. Although I do agree with that, it may also hinge of the placement of couches, chairs and other furnishings. I intend at some point to raise the bottom of the two I have stacked from 16” (bottom of speaker), to 21 inches (bottom of speaker). I vaguely recall the original steel stands I had them on in the 1990’s were about 21” also. I put them on lower stands in my new living room because I felt maybe the stacked double LST’s wouldn’t come across so imposing in the new room. Well, either way, there’s no way I can distract from their imposing appearance in any room, they’re just big as far as AR speakers are from the original ‘classic-period’. Mind you, after the LST production run was over, in came the AR-9. And, like my AR-LST’s, they too are most obvious to any one when first walking into a room. @ jnolan5784, as I have been on this forum since 2004 and I have repeatedly discussed how I use them and where I place them. All I can say is for you to do a search of my posts found on this forum and I’m sure you’ll find the answers you’re looking for. My information is basically what I learned in the late 1960’s and early 1970’s and have made that information my credo. So basics are for AR-LST speakers are: Correct placement against the ‘front-wall’ for best dispersion and bass reproduction. High wattage is a prerequisite also as these speakers require much more raw power than the AR-3a or similar models do. Though, volume levels is like driving a car, go too fast and you’ll learn what is possible and not. For several years I drove my four LST’s with two Phase Linear PL-400 amplifiers that at 4 ohms supplied a healthy 400 watts per-channel and although it was enough for most listeners without question, I personally wanted the absolute maximum wattage I could push into them as I felt they would benefit from. In 2009 I purchased two Phase Linear Series II PL-700 amplifiers and they supply a very healthy 700 watts per-channel without any hiccups and bring these speakers to another and higher-level of realism. Always maintain them with the correct FNM-2 ‘slo-blow’ fuses in place, and as mentioned above, newer fuses may make a slight difference though if unavailable ‘fast-blow’ 4 amp fuse will do but, if you enjoy high listening levels you may be changing fuses frequently. Do not get caught up in the newbie habit of toeing-in or toeing-out as AR has addressed that initially when these speakers were designed. In fact, the whole concept that AR addressed initially with the designing of hemispherical dome tweeters put that to rest with the advent of the AR-3’s tweeters and midrange from the 1950s on. Just looking at the LST's will certainly prove that point even further. Regarding the transformer’s settings: I use setting # 2 as this is the ‘flat’ setting. Setting number one will reduce the bass and highs a bit while setting 3 through 6 will slightly increase the bass and treble respectfully. I find when using high power amplification, this will vary and offer stronger bass response. A transformer was also included on the AR10 and offered more options in sound and placement than the AR-11. I only wish that AR had continued to use this or similar methods in all of their speakers. FM 161

12-26-2021 1:30EST In my earlier days of frequenting practically every ‘hi-fi’ store in Manhattan, NY. It was as if I was walking into a jungle of electronic gear that I was seeing and reading about in the big three available magazines of the time in addition to late edition of "Allied's" catalog and reader-service mailing pieces I was endlessly receiving in in the mail. Feeling wildly overwhelmed, I would first sashay over to the speakers and components I had read about. At the young age of 17 I had to summon up the courage to have the body-language and ability to come across as if I knew about the hobby I was getting deeper into and so interested in. Of course, as some presently do on the internet hi-fi forums, I had to ‘fake’ the little knowledge I had about certain components but, in short time I became conversational. In those formative years, my concentration was on AR speakers and Dynaco electronics. These two brand names seemed to me to be the better and middle-class level components I could barely financially approach. Those two names were almost a ‘standard’ pairing in the field. In fact it wasn’t until after high-school when I started my first full-time job in Manhattan working at a smaller stock-trading firm on Pine St. And although, we had some of the first computers named used in the business, “UniVac” was slowly taking over people like me, a stock-order-clerk over the phone and writing the order by hand, those CPU’s would break down a few times a day making us all work harder. In any event the company told us that someday soon, the room full of ‘open-order’ phone clerks such as myself would be reduced to a hand full of supervisors and computers only. Below, some ‘net’ photo swipes of what I would typically see in a late ’60s early 1970s hi-fi stores, certainly not the best way to audition speakers. Actually, looks like some member's so-called set-ups. Notice speakers randomly incorrectly placed on floors. For some, buying was mostly a roll of the dice. Thankfully, by late 1974 through out 1975 upper-tier showrooms were carrying Phase Linear, Dynaco, SoundCraftsman and many others in that price range. If you wanted to find the even higher priced components, you'd have to seek other stores who carried the 'Higher-End' items. For smug, elitist's budgets that I couldn't afford stores, they were around also. FM 1.8v.

It is as it appears "The antithesis of a proper hi-fi system."

What would E.V. and R.A. comments be like if they each saw these most unlikely combination of boxes? I can only imagine. They'd probably say: "The antithesis of a proper hi-fi system." These attempts at reinventing the wheel is futile and can be misleading to newer and future listeners. Matching speakers connected to matching amplifiers. Anything else is audio-folly. FM

Sorbothane will 'bleed' and leave a oily like stain on any surface. "Blue-Tack' may be better, although it also will tend to excrete an oily stain though less so than sorbotane. Why would you even consider "isolating" as both cabinets are vibrating in similar fashion? I wouldn't be worried about a cabinet vibrating off of the bottom cabinet unless you are using high volumes and then, you'd see any changes occurring and correct it. Ultimately, if you are unnecessarily worried then, use a cheap smallish metal strap on the back of each cabinet to anchor one to the other with small wood screws. In my situation, my speakers are heavy enough where I don't worry and again, both cabinets are vibrating at the same frequency. FM

12-21-2021 12PM EST Dear fedeleluigi, I'm glad that you've posted evidence of actual tests reports but, I fear it may all fall on deaf-ears. Back when I bought my 3a's I read countless test-reports from 1967 to the day I bought AR-3a's in 1971. At first it was a dollar for dollar struggle for me as to which ones I could or would buy but, as I've stated in previous posts, "AR" stated their efforts of an 'up-grade' about their then new AR-3a and that it was a better speaker. And although the AR-3 was actually cheaper back then the AR-3a, AR's own admission of the 3a being a better speaker is what ultimately swayed my decision and, I'm glad I listened to what AR Corp. was saying. Fifty years later for me I find it laughably sad how some folks refuse to understand but, instead have created this misconception solely out of ignorance and inexperience. I've repeated my post below in which I speak of more of the physical aspects whereas you've provided scientific and proven results. 'Here', it's much like the older guys who drive around in newish Chevy-Corvettes. Some don't know a thing about engines or cars but, they must and just have to have a Corvette. Same these days with certain heralded vintage speakers. Additionally, some just don't know, want to know or understand how 'every change makes a difference' in the world of high-fidelity. Seemingly, only a few here and across the 'consumer-world' delve into how important and with valid reasoning it is to put together a better system by using better cables for both speaker hook-up and better cabling between components, better phono-cartridges, tone-arms, tables, CD players and an understanding of the differences room placement can make. I liken it to certain automobile drivers who just jump into the car never thinking or considering or caring about the mechanics or fundamentals of their machine while many don't give a damn about the rules of the road or have any common-courtesy while driving. In closing it seems that we are all victimized by the 'Key-Board-Shield' as some will lie, exaggerate, and base their perceptions and opinions on B.S. while parroting, plagiarizing and making statements that they've read elsewhere and adopted as heir own all the while not having any real experience or knowledge. And to those who despise me or have given into the human weakness of jealousy and arrogance will know who I'm speaking to. FM "exceptional sparkling highs never harsh, quite electrostatic" For me and probably the masses, AR's are anything but that although I agree about not being 'harsh' though certainly not "electrostatic" like "sparkling highs", though maybe on a good day. Also, when folks talk about their speakers, I believe it to be helpful to also describe the rest of their set-up as a point of reference. Where on the roster of sound quality does the whole set-up sit? Is it a $1000. or $3,000. amplifier or pre-amp. Was the personal opinion based on a $100. phono cartridge or a $3,000. cartridge. Was the turntable very old with poor resolution or one with an precision high quality tonearm that was properly set-up. Was the CD player a $200. unit or a $2,000. player? Are there better cables and interconnects or the really cheap ones that come with the unit or of truly high-quality? All these items do make a huge difference. Also of major importance is the proper attention made in terms of room-placement. Mind you, I'm not professing that any one here must spend oodles of money on such stuff as is done in the world of 'high-end', most here sadly do not but, cables and components must be at least of a better quality standard before any unqualified opinions can be taken as absolute truth as opinions are biased and not objective. This information as it's always helpful for members to describe in text or with fotos showing what their set-ups are composed of to be able to know what level of sound quality described. Otherwise it's a bunch of bunk. Being a member here for almost 17 years the consensus seems to be many of the imperative and necessary steps are generally not taken as many simply throw speakers into a room and are content with that. As an owner and ardent fan of AR speakers for 50 years I have always been concerned with taking the requisite steps to make my system sound as good as it can. For me, all of the inputs, cables etc. I use add up to making my system be all it is capable of being. Many on the internet speak with such exaggerated statements made about their sound-quality until you become aware of the rest of the set-up and then you realize they're talking through their hats and actually have no real premise of which to speak. This is obvious why the majority do not post fotos of their set-ups. Some actually believe if they have AR speakers then their set-up must sound good and are content with that. Sadly, that is not the way to better listening and surprisingly still exists long after hi-fi became a worthy and fun experience years ago. Simply put, the more effort, expense and self-learning one puts into their system the better it will sound. Almost anything flies on the internet but, for maximum pleasure one must arm themselves with knowledge of the field of high-fidelity before they can accurately speak about 'sound-quality'. FM 1.6v.

"Mostly fixed it. Sounds great but has a bit of a hum that I can’t resolve. Can’t hear it when music is playing so I ignore it." That's a strong will, I guess. It must be killing you. You guys are lucky the site moral police haven't come down on you as they like to do with me.

I joined in Nov. 2004 and my archive only shows from Feb. 2006 Others have posts from 2004 on yet, mine are gone.

With feelings of nostalgia, a typical feeling at the end of each year, I sometimes look back at older posts. I have noticed that many member's posts including my own from years ago have disappeared. As I recall, there were a number of key and important posts by knowledgeable members that are no longer visible. Why are posts deleted?

11-30-2021 11PM l've always loved those Bose stands with their late '50s early '60s design, even had a 42" table with same base design in my old meet and greet area but, these are too impractical with most speakers. In fact I own two pairs i found on the streets of NYC around 1988 or so. Foolishly thought I could balance an AR-LST on one as I held and tried to position it. Result? There was no way it would balance the cabinet and there's no way I would trust such a valuable speaker on an inadequate and incorrect stand using LST's. Below: stands I first used to support my LST's back in the 1990's, available on eBay rite now. When I bought them back then, they cost me much more, I recall they were made by Target a high-end stand builder. They also have built-in spikes and although in turn they put tiny spike holes in the bottoms of one pair of LST's, they didn't shift or move at all and thus were very secure. https://www.ebay.com/itm/384424418372 I believe capable of 200lb. capacity each. The stands I use now are much stronger and better balance the LST type of speaker. For me, steel is the strongest and most secure of course. 30 FM

11-30-2-21 10pm est They'd sound even better than you're presently hearing if they were against a solid clear wall as they were designed to be. Against a wall which serves to aid in bass response/reinforcement for any acoustic suspension speaker typically requires, I can assure you will sound much better, bigger, stronger. These were not designed to be placed 'into' the room as one can do with other box ported speakers. More supportive stands at least 21 inches or more would place them closer to 'ear-height' (while seated), which will also aid in better sound. See link below. 11 FM

Giorgio AR, a nice story and especially nice to make the connection between the hobby and the actual person. Sadly, some folks hide behind the keyboard and web screen never revealing their true character and even hide behind it to be insincere. They hide behind fictitious names and symbols or protect their shallow selves as I often refer to them as 'web-snipers'. There's even a few on this forum and I hope they know how they actually come across to the rest of us as real persons with nothing to hide. I could mention names but, why bother, let them stew in their own venom.

Sixty plus years ago, many large public halls had used multiples of the somewhat famous 755 Altec 8 inch speakers that the first AR offered. FM

11-4-2021 5:30P.M. EST Re: AR's live vs recorded demo in Carnegie Hall. This topic can be misleading to many others and has been discussed on this site before. "GCT' is 35000sqft. , my living room is 26X12.5 and is equal to less than 350sqft. "The Main Concourse is located on the upper platform level of Grand Central, in the geographical center of the station building. The 35,000-square-foot (3,300 m2) concourse leads directly to most of the terminal's upper-level tracks, although some are accessed from passageways near the concourse." Inside the Grand Concourse — approximately three-fourths the size of a football field or 275 feet long by 120 feet wide by 125 feet high 35,000-square-foot is the size of the main waiting hall. 1.) https://www.google.com/search?q=square+footage+of+grand+central+station+main+terminal%3F&ei=GEOEYaa0ArC-ggeh7JjYBA&oq=square+footage+of+grand+central+station+main+terminal%3F&gs_lcp=Cgdnd3Mtd2l6EAw6BwgAEEcQsANKBAhBGABQnVhY5m5g3IEBaAFwAngAgAFIiAH_ApIBATaYAQCgAQHIAQjAAQE&sclient=gws-wiz&ved=0ahUKEwimoJbGxv_zAhUwn-AKHSE2BksQ4dUDCA4 2.) https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=82842.0 3.) https://pulsecinemas.com/brands/bgw 4.) https://www.planning.org/greatplaces/spaces/2013/grandcentral.htm While at ‘GCT’ I heard from the top of the room’s roof numerous times in passing but only from a distance of the AR showroom. As I recall the sound was barely percepable over the din of people noise. Maybe AR had the volume set at low? However there would never come a day where AR's set-up at 'GCT' was room filling, certainly not. Back in 1977 to 1983, in my own personal experience of driving two AR3a speakers in my first business’s main area of about 870sqft. (35X25X12) and driven by a singular Phase Linear PL-400 amplifier pushing approximately 400 wpc @4ohms sound was quite impressive for me and everyone who was audible witness to it but, it didn't sound anything like my double Phase Linear PL-700's driving four LST speakers. My own 60 wpc "Dynaco" amplifier was never 'big' sounding, especially with inefficient speakers as the AR-3'a and whenever I attempted to reach 'loud' it always ended in blown fuses and tweeters because that power rating could never approach a loud and pleasing sound level with-out 'clipping'. Years ago in movie theaters and such, highly efficient speakers like the Altec A7 and similar gave big sound due to it's 'horn' projection-design cabinet however, power ratings never approached power ratings ever since Bob Carver, "BGW" and others introduced 'high-power' in the early 1970's. Being a musical instrument player years ago in the mid and late 1960’s in indoor and outdoor venues with our band's own PA system and additionally aided by the house PA taught me that high power was always something that escaped any level of volume satisfaction every time. High wattage was not available as is used today. In terms of needed power for big spaces the requiremnet will always be answered by big power. FM 1.6

Giorgio, thank you for your kind comments. But, I must tell you, I'd like a pair of those AR-10's. Having the transformers in my LST's, I know the advantage it offers and no doubt makes the AR-10 probably one of AR's best speakers in the heritage of the 3a's. FM

Was Roy A. and Ed V. ahead of the speaker cabinet styling curve, or not? As the owner of 3 pairs of AR-LST’s I wonder if either one of those men had been at a function where a band was playing and were using a Gibson guitar amplifier back in 1960 or from earlier years? Being the curious type like any other young kid, somewhere deep with-in my mind, I may have seen such a radio cabinet of similar design in my travels. My father was a busy ‘tinkerer’ with old discarded radios back in the early 1950s and I was witness to his experimentation in countless attempts to fix small tube radios he had found on the curb. Many RCA’s, Zenith’s, Dumont’s, Philco’s, Admiral’s and on and on had the full treatment of changing tubes and checking if they were any good. If he or I saw a discarded TV or radio on the curb, we'd automatically scavenge it of its tubes, speaker, and knobs. Years, back before I was born and through out the 1950s and early 1960s as I saw, it seemed that most drug stores always offered 'Tube-Testers'. A huge console about the size of a early 1980s stand-up arcade video games and also counter models tucked away in some unimportant area of the store. On any given Saturday morning my father would drag me to the local drug store with a paper bag or two full of tubes and I’d look up at him figuring out which tube could be tested according to the supplied binder listing most types of tubes that required being plugged into the appropriate socket. Most times the tubes were bad or half-bad and he’d throw those out when we returned home but, often times a tube was retained for future use. I still have a few old cigar boxes of his filled with tubes, some odd looking ones also. By the time I was 7 to 10 or so when I was barely able to keep pace with his fast walking, he’d take me by subway from Brooklyn into Manhattan and we’d walk along Cortlandt Street, aka “Radio-Row” and we walk in and out of the many radio-stores where he’d price out an important tube or mostly we’d stare at the new model radios and TV’s all of which we couldn’t afford. Seeing ‘raw’ speakers and radio related items hanging on the walls and in showcases must’ve left an indelible impression on me as I continued to scourer those same stores by the mid to late 1960’s and on lunch hour of my first job on Wall Street in 1967 to 1968 only to return again and again looking for ‘raw’ speaker cabinets to put together for my first real component system. It consisted of 2 empty MDF cabinets about the same size as an AR-3a and I stuffed those with two 12 Jensen speakers and two exponential horns with a little ‘cap’ in between. For an amplifier, in 1967 I built from the kit, the “Dynaco” PAS-3X pre-amp and the big power amp was a Dynaco ST-35 tube amplifier. It only supplied 17.5 watts per-side and driving those highly efficient drivers, it was able to play loudly, impressive. An entry level Garrard Lab 44B, a Shure M3d cartridge were my go-to system. (Please don’t tell anyone but, I still have those pieces tucked away in my garage.) Back then in my early formative electronic related item days, time seemed to go by slowly and too slow in my saving of spare change to someday be able to buy those AR speakers I lusted after. The unfinished AR cabinets were seemingly all I’d ever be able to afford but, those dark walnut cabinets were the most desired. Every nite, I’d fall asleep looking at the usual AR brochures that were common on most store counters and dream about how someday I’d be able to have either the AR-5 or AR-3’s. With the Nam war never seeming to end, my stint in the US military interrupted everything. The wonderful rock band I was playing in had to breakup because 3 of the members decided oddly enough to be military men also. Yeah sure, we were all afraid to die in that war and never see the rest of our lives. In fact, I lost two high school buddies to that war. So, getting back to Roy and Ed, did they see these Gibson amplifiers at some town dance nite? Was Roy or Ed doing the “Lindy” when they caught his eye/ear? I vaguely in the deep canyons of my mind recall that three sided shape somewhere other than the 1972 release of the AR-LST. Maybe it was fate that was speaking to me and that someday, I would be the proud owner of such a speaker as the 'LST'. Actually, living the above history, I have to shamelessly say, I deserve them! FM

10-6-2021 A good feeling to be commented on by a couple of members of one of the most popular and highly regarded ‘HIGH-END’ sites on the web. "Audiogon" is a noted 'HIGH-END' component web-site where members and owners of outstanding audio systems discuss their set-ups and share their knowledge.

In a word, beautacious.

Pete, your last paragraph is intriguing but, I would need further explanation. However small, adding more capacitance would decrease 'highs' wouldn't it, and adding a 10 ohm resistor as you suggest brings us to what value that the amplifier sees? My speaker cables run about 30 or more feet per side, I use 12 AWG with the 2amp slo-blow fuses.

Hi DavidR, no magnetic-field amps for me though, some Carvers did receive some good press. Many amps in general will not do well at 4 ohms. All of my PL-400 amps are the original Series I Mk2 designs from the mid '70's. My PL-700's are Series II, and are Full Complementary from the early '80s and have been rebuilt. When Carver first introduced those magnetic-field cube shaped amps many folks went after them. Reports were menza-menza though for some folks, there's a new affection for them. The series of magnetic-field designs you speak of came later and again folks went for them and were popular though, I've never tried one. The 'pro' models were and still are widely used in commercial applications so, evidently, they're good to go. Carver's tube designs have received much praise. FM