frankmarsi

AR-LST's are very demanding about placement, even more so than regular 'box' speakers, placement is paramount and more so than other conventional speakers. Many of the set-ups I've seen here tell me the listener is not getting their full level of enjoyment, in fact most I've seen are incorrectly set-up. The first two rooms I had them in caused them too suffer to a degree. It wasn't until I had them in the room they're in presently have they bloomed into their full glory. In fact they've never sounded as good as they do now, few understand the level of high-quality sound these are capable of until they've been properly placed in a room. However, I have learned early on like all acoustic suspension speakers, placement is critical and especially so with the 'LST'. When I relocated to where I am now, I was especially excited about how they would sound. I knew a rectangular room that afforded me a free 'front-wall' was the key. And although initially I tried placing them 3/4 into the room before I cleared the front wall, their sound was less than acceptable and their bass-response was at best dreadful. The 'front-wall' with long converging side walls assisted greatly and proved ultimately necessary. Many non-cognoscenti do not realize this, thus they don't realize this speaker's full capability of stunning bass. Why they offer more bass response than a AR-3a has been enigmatic for me all these years but, why question greatness? Their 'huge' quality of sound output is simply sublime. So much so, that I am truly grateful I own them and that I finally have them in the type of room they demand. I seek no other speaker for my listening pleasure. And that's a fact, jack! So, I'm not certain if I own them or, they own me. So, I say to you Bill and all, when you do have a opportunity to listen to the 'AR-LST' be aware of set-up and placement otherwise you may be sorely disappointed. And of course, as always, the requisite high power amplification is just as important. All the while it must be in mind that 'far-field' listening is what their design also demands. So yes, they are truly fussy but, isn't anything else in life that's truly worth it seem to be? P.S. I am not a casual listener, and I approve of this message. FM

You forgot to mention that 'Qua-Co' is in Blackwood, N.J.

'As rational human beings, we should be clear about things that we can be clear about'. Finally, someone offers a pair of AR-LST’s for the value they are truly worth. Let’s not forget that for people like myself that have been using AR speakers for over 48 years and has been listening and training my ears to be able to discern what excellent sound actually sounds like for longer, I feel this price is warranted. And not to sound like some others who defend what they own with such expressions as “IMO” or words such as; “my system sounds good to me and can match set-ups of higher price” , or silliness like “my $200. phono cartridge approaches and sounds as good as a $1500. to $4000. cartridge” or, don’t specify their amps power at watts per channel but, instead confusingly state total power is nothing more than ludicrous attempts at soothing their minds as their systems are likely of lesser caliber and accuracy. Going back to when the AR-LST was first released in 1972, I myself was taken aback to realize that AR had actually produced a speaker that was and sounded more accurate than my new AR-3a’s I had recently bought in 1971. The seller here says these are for the Mac275 amplifier. Well, that’s not nearly the case as these speakers require much more wattage. I speak from experience as I have attempted using my LST’s with other amps of lower power but, was sadly let down. My Phase LInear PL-400 at 400WPC@ 4 ohms is a worthy power source but, it too only nearly approached the necessary power to bring these speakers to where they perform their absolute best as they do better with almost double that power as is the case when using my Phase Linear PL-700 Series II at nearly 700 watts per channel @ 4 ohms. Beyond the ridiculous offerings of AR-3’s and AR-1’s for large sums of money that they are certainly not worthy of, a pair of AR-LST’s are clearly worthy of the $4,000. to $4,500. asking price range as they are here. I've read of others owning LST's but they just won't admit to the speakers huge appetite for high wattage for some odd reason. I recall when the AR-LST was first released in 1972, I dreamed about one day being able to purchase a pair but, unfortunately I was not financially able to at the young age of 22 years. When I finally acquired my present set of four LST's in the late 1980's, I was not only shocked that I did but, I still knew they required loads of power and that I had to purchase bigger amplifiers at an additional expense. In the early 1990's, I used my PL-400 with one pair, and although they sounded really good (much better than my AR-3a’s did with the same amplifier), in the back of my mind I dreamt about the phenomenal sound they would offer with increased power, knowing twice that amount would surely be what they demanded. Then, in 1990 I met a AR corporate big-wig from Britain at a stereo showroom in N.Y.C. highlighting AR’s newly released amplifier, pre-amp and speakers. He boasted of using four LST’s and two Phase Linear PL-700’s in 1974. Then and there, I knew I had a new goal in mind and I had to reach it if I wanted maximum listening pleasure. Fast-forward to 2009 and I purchased two expertly rebuilt Phase Linear PL-700 Series II’s as I was certain the AR-LST would benefit from such massive power which I immediately experienced upon hooking them up. My earlier room’s size and acoustics at that time did not offer the best situation. For the ultimate listening experience it was easy to hear the difference of using more power as the AR-LST’s really opened up in terms of a more accurate and a completely satisfying sound experience in my new digs. The home I presently own is much more conducive to better sound and is almost approaching ideal in its potential, ‘ideal’ being a room designed around one’s system. The new room is much bigger and affords me the best these speakers are capable of. Check here: Do AR speakers really sound that good? ** MORE NEW VIDEO** https://www.ebay.com/itm/AR-LST-accoutic-reasearch-collectible-vintage-speaker-for-mc275/323929499338?hash=item4b6bb3e6ca:g:n7MAAOSwwb9djV4D

Men! I think this could be a fun time to be had by all. We'd just have to make plan and, I would need adequate time to set up the house to accommodate such an event. I'd be very happy to have you fellas over and a handful of others of course. I would venture a guess it would be more than one day of listening bliss so, plan accordingly. There are enough decent restaurants in the area so we'd be enjoying that aspect of meeting each other also. Let it be known: This is a vinyl exclusive home, as my system is analog and analog only. Anyone carrying or attempting to smuggle in CD's would have to leave them at the door. Or be sent out for 're-grooving'. Can you dig it? FM

Anyone that doesn't think better quality cabling (in particular interconnects), makes a difference for the better, needs to have their ears examined. Period!

RE: removing old glue. Use regular 70 % rubbing alcohol, makes it easy-peasy. Use a dull-ish butter knife to scrape it off into paper-towels as it's sticky and messy. I usually get the masonite as clean as possible for best adhesion on new foam. Using less white glue is the key as it will take longer to 'set' if too much is used. Spread with fingers or swab and apply to both sides. Apply glue to cone side of foam first, then to cone edge, let both sides become 'tacky' before moving on. Drying 20 to 40 minutes when using thin amount of glue, then apply to underside of foam outer rim of cone, and then apply glue to basket masonite surface. Let it get tacky then slowly press cone onto outer rim of basket and slowly press as you rotate the basket. There's really no need to use so many clothes pins when using a small amount of glue (white glue is best) while slowly rotating basket equally pressing down on foam edge with fingers and or a dull edge of a flat surface nylon/plastic tool. Out of the 20 or so refoams I've completely with-out shimming. I agree using shims is the fool proof method and if inexperienced it may be the best way, cutting that dust-cap with an X-actoi knife can be daunting and can render sloppy appearance if poorly done. I've tried a few different foam suppliers and have found 'Parts-Express' to be the best and they supply 2-3 different dust-caps of different sizes, along with swabs and glue. The best way is to be patient and work slowly. When work is finished carefully check that cone is free floating by equally applying a few fingers while pressing up and down on cone using equal pressure at the time all around. I also use a 1.5 volt double 'A' battery to check cone's motion and carefully feel and listen for any voice-coil rubbing. For cones that sag down due to a sagging 'spider' I've shoved plastic bags from the super-market under the cone to facilitate easier conditions and to keep the cone steady. Afterwards slowly/carefully pulling out plastic bag. If necessary, I've cut the plastic screen material AR used to keep fiber-glass out and then re-glue screening back in. Cut screen along basket's metal area and not directly into screen. This was necessary due to a sagging spider and the only time I've to use a couple clamps/clothes pins to hold cone in place. Install woofers back in cabinet the following day, hook-up and play a piece of music to see if all is O.K. but, don't get too loud until two days later. I've had the misfortune to buy a set of 12 AR cones that were freshly refoamed but, the previous owner had glued the foams to the underside of the cone's rim and that was time consuming to undo and replace properly. Good luck and if all is well, you can enjoy your accomplishment while listening. FM

One of the best threads here in quite some time. FM

Wow.

I.M.O. Paint them black, it's the only way to go, if not, it's lipstick on a pig. Pine is not an attractive grain pattern and is rarely used and, in most every case never cosmetically attractive. Did another call them beautiful, really? They're a far cry from that. If painted black and additional mids and tweeters are added, they have a chance. Otherwise, present a low desirability factor unless positioned horizontally as they were intended to be used by AR hiding the unfinished side.

"Vintage-AR" might sell them.

O.M.G. really? Excuses, and more excuses, then, requests? Photos please, where's your high-end laboratory/space in still fotos, I almost forgot you have video capability, show that too. Otherwise....... Then maybe it would nice if you list the degrees you hold, test documentation, test equipment used, microphones, mixers, DACs, room damping and cables used, along with comparative A-B recordings. Otherwise....... This thread is about the peaceful sharing of still fotos and or videos of member's systems. You come (butt-in) with comments such as "crap vinyl" adding a negative tone and obviously directed at the thread's originator, which is me. Is there a chance you've read that I'm a dedicated vinyl person and owner of 7000+ vinyl disks replete with full 'brush & vacumm' and 'UltraSonic' cleaning methods. Have spent thousands of dollars on tonearms, high-end sota cartridges. Disrupting the enjoyment and fun some of us were having and still ignoring that this post is all about the sharing of members systems in that you won't show your's. What don't you get about a short video recorded amateur-style on a $59. camera/phone low quality format posted on this site in low-quality before you inject particular levels of comment? People I know who have seen and listened have emailed me about how good it sounds and other's if equipped with decent CPU speakers are in complete agreement with my opinion You've made this into a big production and as I've said in every post of mine that you've invaded, I'm done with it!

I repeat: "If you're not receiving a good quality from my video clips, something is askew on your end for certain". I have sent files to life-long stereo friends who have excellent systems and they were amazed of the very good quality. I'm getting excellent listening results as does anyone who has decent computer speakers and, I made mention of that requirement in the beginning of my post. I'm not here to enlighten you, nor do I care as I'm truly only interested in the pleasure that my over 50+ years of consumer audio experience and knowledge give me in my main system. I have read the repetitive, monotonous and self admission of futility in the silly 'Blaster' whatever posts that have ended in no useful results for anyone. Even an honored and respected member here has told you, that you could never replicate an AR-LST with dog tail chasing. It seems you expect me and others to pay credence and lend an ear to your posts. I don't have any need to, and typically as a matter of course automatically pass them by. If you seek credibility, show me, and everyone else here on this site, what your listening to, tell us of your components that are used and include a clip of what is heard in your room and perhaps I might be able to understand. You haven't done so, and yet I have listed all of my components, cabling, high-end cartridges and so on and even showed multiple sound clips. While you are continuously skirting and avoiding the issues at hand while not offering any substantial proof. The proof is in the listening. After all of my time-in, my 50+ years of learning experiences and dedicated practices of precision set-up 'front-ends' affording me the best system I've ever had in my entire audio life has no need to stop off for such foolishness to please anyone but myself and my visiting guests who are always elated and leave emotionally moved by the music, and super-high sound quality they've just heard. Avoidance, and hiding behind the shield of the internet while double talking is lessening all potential believability. The ball is in your court, show us a short clip that is representative of the sound you hear from your listening position as I and other members have done and things would change in terms of what I have already mentioned. Show us some views of your listening room or at least two sides of a four walled room showing component and speaker placement. To reiterate; my $59. pay as you go phone renders excellent results both audibly and photographically though, maybe not as good as your expensive Iphone can but, can certainly offer an insight to one who has ears that know what to listen for.

Contrary to what you say, the iPhone has a notably good audio and frequency response https://kenrockwell.com/apple/iphone-5s-audio-quality.htm It's what you use for your listening components and room that matter, and especially judging from images that you've shown I'm forced to wonder as others would, if the room and speakers are properly arranged or if any sort of accurate statements/listening can be made. Fanfare for the Common Man is hardly a good piece to use for a thorough or even brief comparison as it is somewhat limited in its presentation and certainly too lengthy. If this is what you're using as shown in your foto below, I'd like to see the rest of the room as shown from a your typical seating perspective before I would find fault with your phone's ability. To aid in understanding, I'm sure we'd all like to hear a sampling of what your playback sounds like as this is what this thread is all about. If you're not receiving a good quality from my video clips, something is askew on your end for certain.

Giorgio, there is a whole web-site devoted to Lenco tables, google it, it's huge. I feel it is very unfair and insulting that my thread has been moved and relegated to this area of "the Classic Speaker Pages". I have also been the victim of a couple of antagonistic, disruptive and anger-baiting vitriolic individuals who seem to always go after my posts whenever my stereo-system is mentioned.

To GeneK: Now, you're scaring me! Nor will I leave my surroundings and great sounding system to go hear another's unless I knew it could challenged mine. Besides, there's nothing as comfortable as my own commode. It's ana-log ya know. So ultimately, once again, I'm rewarded with no one posting photos or descriptions or much less videos. P.S. yes another quote: ""If what I heard is in the the recording it is a crap vinyl recording." I will forgive for you know not what you speak of. To the intruder: I feel no need to explain or defend but, if you're looking for information, here ya go. I've been on this forum since 2004, that's over 15 years now and I've been an AR speaker loyalist since I first heard AR-4s in 1965 when I was 15 yrs. old. I have owned and perfected my systems since I first purchased new AR-3a's in 1971-2, that's almost half a century ago. And you did what, for how long? I've said and written all I could, read all that I wanted to and still I am unchallenged by another's vintage system. Unless there's someone hiding in the deep forest of grill cloth trees or wallowing in the static pool of ferro-fluid tweeter coil coolant or perhaps a desperado hiding under a large AR speaker that's not properly mounted on a 12 to 21 inch stand. I will sit in my living room and relish my efforts and personal dedication to the finest vintage system that I've ever heard. Mine! And for your edification I'll repeat; oh sound technician in the highest (sarcasm), you couldn't refrain from the nastiness, and argument provocation, huh? It's is a $59.00 pay as you go J3 samsung phone, one recess mounted pin head microphone. So, there is no way you or anyone else could possibly comment on the microphone's directionality. Enough said here, really! I've been a dedicated vinyl person all of my life, I typically use $2,000. to $4,000. cartridges mounted on $1,000.and $2,000+ tonearms. My system is set-up and 'tuned' to perfection. I have no need to listen to anyone or anything else except the next recording that I'm expecting to arrive in the mail. I have shown, and described in detail and now even have allowed others to hear my system, providing they have decent cpu speakers, whereas you haven't or at best vaguely done so. This thread has gone nowhere and through no fault of my own. I've been the only person on it who has shown a video of an ultimate high-powered AR-LST system and I really don't find it amusing or necessary to be challenged as there is no challenge here for me, I'm beyond that at this stage of sound system building. Except for a couple of other members who were gracious enough to share their system, you haven't and for what I believe to be obvious reasons.

The so-called 'reverb' you speak of is in the recording. The cell phone's pick-up/mic is furthest from the speakers as I sit approximately 15 from the front wall/speaker location. Quote: ""It seems such a paradox that you have labored to create a fine analog system but are relying on analog to digital to analog conversion to show it. "" Agreed and so true but, these are the only avenues we have here, and I'm not relying on it, I'm already convinced of the high quality playback that I enjoy. Also, I bet if I had you here even for one listening session, you'd become an d analog person too. Quote: "" It is obvious your system can play with ease and authority but the nuance one would expect from such a system is lost in these examples."" Yeah, well, agreeing once more but, again, such is the apparatus (the net) afforded to us all in this given situation. Maybe we should all take Gene up on his offer and show up at his house and see. Oregon is simply lovely this time of year. I'll throw in $40. bucks for a set of CPU speakers too.

If I may quote "newandold" earlier in this thread, as he said: ""It’s amazing ? that just by hearing the jazz on your video I can pick up the clean, crystal clear sound you’re getting."". I'll ask. didn't anyone else hear the same, if not then why? I did, and very easily so. I wasn't implying that we all hear it as 100% as it actually is but, a reasonable facsimile can and does come through a decent set of computer speakers, there's no denying that because others have heard it, I hear it loud and very clearly, in fact it impressed me. If on the other hand if one's computer speakers are tiny, and tinny sounding of course not and not even a hint will come through. I often surf high-end stereo sites of mega-buck systems to get a sampling of how the high-end has grown and even then I only get the gist of it's true quality because the net does have its limitations but, a certain level does come through, enough to tell me those guys are right up on a higher level of quality. So, on the 'to-do-list' maybe a purchase of decent size computers will be as beneficial as I'm saying they will be. Gene, are you relying on tiny, tinny built in speakers? Are most others? (LOL) Perish the thought! I'm actually laughing now because it dawned on me all at once that I'm a fully dedicated analog listener through and through and here I am defending digital sound through a computer and you haven't yet indicated what you're using with a computer or sound system. Certainly there's no need to, though the interest and curiosity of other's may be satisfied.

As I've indicated, I used a $59.00 entry level Samsung cell phone and my computer uses two small in plastic enclosure 3 inch tweeter/mids and a 5 inch woofer on the floor below my desk. I paid $20.00 for it and it's a cheap Altec offering I bought in 2001. Any music that's on the web usually sounds decent enough to get a good idea and sampling there of. For those so uninspired by music on the web (which is pretty much includes all music) to be relying on their computers built-in speakers isn't saying much. Depending on such weak excuses and tiny little garbage built-in speakers is ridiculous. Mostly every modern TV for sale offers crappy sound unless the consumer buys what's offered as out-board speakers for an additional $100.+ Pardon my bragging but, on my computer, my posted clips sound excellent. Whoever is complaining about not being in stereo or for another matter is a numbskull as it is what it is. One of the first posters "newandold" to respond also indicated that my clip sounded excellent as did "crumpets" and his clip also sounded good. it's obviously the unwillingness to expose awful set-ups because of their apparent short comings due to its low quality of sound or the mish-mash of a poorly set-up system with lesser components piled up like a messy garage's storage shelve. And that's just explaining the sound aspect of it as they can still post stills of their systems but, don't. I have surfed the web long enough to know that one can distinguish good from lousy sound unless one relies on their small crappy built-in computer speakers, especially on lap-tops. Even my $1400. Mac had one crappy tiny speaker so,I simply connected my old CPU speakers that I have for 20 years now. Isn't it the norm that when one buys a new TV they are usually forced to buy outboard speakers too, or else you'll be starving your ears. As a electronics/speaker/hi-fi person the entirety of my teen and adult life I naturally found it necessary to equip myself with a better quality of sound emanating from my computer, damn I spend enough time and money on the silly screen machine, there's just no other way. If you ask me, once again it's the usual hiding behind the cloak and shield of the internet as the prime defense and excuse. Through such a disguise, newcomers talk as if they're experts, half-baked opinions fly with glorious colors and the numbskull level meter is always pegging in the red area. But, to be really honest, my system sounds great because I've invested time, research, knowledge, dedication and key money and made all of the correct selections of equipment to make it sound excellent and it even comes through as such through a $59. cheap-sh_t plastic cell phone and $20., 20 year old plastic computer speakers. So, I know there really aren't any valid reasons to hold back unless a person so chooses to. That, in of itself only contributes to a lesser degree of communication. If I were an outsider, I could imagine that all AR-4's sound just like AR-9s. So, there's no excuse unless a person simply doesn't have the need or desire to expose their 'stuff' as it where and that is fine also. I just thought it would fun to see, listen and learn but, I'm done with it now as I've tried four times over the course of a couple of years and still I've have been met with the same stone wall. I won't go back to sanding, deoxidizing of potentiometers or other utilitarian endeavors no, I'll simply go back to listening to my system as it is complete and ready to envelope me in gorgeous sound quality. In closing; if one had even the simple meager computer speakers that I use, they'd be able to hear how good my video/system does sounds and other's might.

O.K. a fair explanation but, I feel there's more to it like a lack of anything to show or hear. One can make their own soup with all fresh ingredients or simply open a can and heat it in a microwave. There are distinct differences. So, it the forum continues as all talk and no show. Boring, monotonous and with-out have anything to aspire to, especially for newcomers.

So, this post has been here for just over a month and less than a hand full have shown their set-ups and videos. Some bold enough to show other's instead of their own. What does this say about member's set-ups?

Well, Chris, thanks for this one, no pun intended. You may recall that for AR speakers that I'm a big proponent of using huge amplification to power AR speakers so, of course my next question is: what are you using to power the lovely display of your LST's? I would also suggest that you read if you haven't already one of the original test reports done by a well known reviewer stating that he thought LST's could benefit by using something even bigger than the original PL-700 amplifier he used in his testing.

JKent really? Crumpets was specific when he asked: ""but I am thinking about upgrading the AT95 cartridge. I only caught the AR bug fairly recently and find myself enjoying vinyl again. Any suggestions in the $100-300 range would be appreciated."" This is the first time out of four attempts that I've tried for a few years to inspired folks to display and review their systems with video and it seems to be working thus far. I trust the more folks display, the more others will be inspired to do like wise. Staying on point is important as this could lead to folks truly discussing their systems instead of the usual ad nauseam fare here about capacitors, wood sanding and the constant talk about being a tinkerer instead of a truly dedicated music listener. Because thus far to me, this site has turned into just that, a tinker-er's week-end on the work bench instead of the real and true mission of AR speakers which is to hear and enjoy music. Granted, these old birds (classic AR's) do need a certain level of work and repair but we've all covered those points countless times already. All one has to do is read the numerous older posts, it's all there to be read and learned from. I've tried to inspire as "chris1-this1" has mentioned by showing his set-up. Now, if we can only get him to post a video so we may have a sample of what it sounds like. And in turn, hopefully, others will follow suit and display their set-ups. Ultimately, this could lead to more musical enjoyment for all concerned here. In terms of cartridges, I've already mentioned the AT-440ML series or the Denon DL-301II in the $200 to $300 category. And for folks who want to delve into more costly cartridges, I've already outlined what has brought my system to a level of true-audiophile quality in older posts of mine. The adherence to the principal of 'good in equals good out' truly is the only way our systems will be of a higher listening quality. After all, isn't this what our collective coal truly is? There are some here who utilize sub-par input devices making their set-ups sound no better or lesser than what I was using with my AR speakers over 45+ years ago. I feel it's time we all become more progressive and up the game and listening quality of our systems less this site becomes merely a time capsule and continues towards being non-valid in the world of high-fidelity which is something the designers of AR speakers didn't plan for us. FM

Hi crumpets, and thanks for letting us hear and see your set-up. It sounds very good to me. In my opinion. I'd say room position of speakers is pivotal, and as typical, AR classic cabinets usually don't benefit from 'toe-in' as most other conventional box speakers do. To go into a whole explanation about room placement, if you ask me, I'd say the internet can be your best friend in learning the best way to set-up speakers for best over-all response and following the basics will help. Do the research and you'll come away with the best options. Do be aware that there is a lot of garbage on the net. Mis-informed folks who express their opinions with this half-baked misinformation can be very misleading. There's much information on this site and others so, I'd say do the reading and utilize the basic and well-known conventional rules regarding placement. The basic rules are your best friend here but, some filtering is necessary. Regarding cartridge choice, as I've mentioned above, for entry low cost ones, it's hard to beat the Audiotechnica AT-440ML series or the entry level Ortofon Red for moving magnets. For entry level moving coil, it's hard to beat the Denon DL-301II but, you'll also need a S.U.T.and there are single input simple ones that you can find for not much money used on the auction site. Again, do the research and you'll be surprised how much you will learn. Cartridge 'set-up' is very important and once learned it will render the best results you can get. As I can see, your turntable is not in the best location as it is shown and more vibration isolation will greatly improve your vinyl sound also. Keeping your vinyl clean should be addressed and will also reward you with the best listening experience. A word of caution about amplifiers. Unless you have prior experience with electronics, don't even attempt working on any units as it can be dangerous with-out knowing what you're doing. Thanks for posting your set-up and let's hope others will come forward by doing the same by showing all of us here. One can learn much simply be seeing and hearing another's set-up, it will confirm if they're on the right track and know what they're doing and can inform you of possible options. In simple words, the best anyone can do for themselves in this hobby, is to 'learn to listen' and 'listen to learn'. I just now put that phrasing together and, it's what I've done all of my life and it has led me to where I want to be. If you have decent size outboard computer speakers, and turn the volume up on my videos, you'll hear what I'm talking about. FM P.S. I've now entirely used up my 200mb space on this site and may delete these two videos and post others?

Forgot to fully answer Bob so........ ""my limiting factor is my choice of cartridge. I cant bring myself to spending the kind of money Stereophile thinks it takes to buy a decent cart. I am using an older Shure something or another, not the V5 or whatever that one was. I really dont want an outboard phono amp and my Adcom wont accept a low level MC. so I am leaning towards something in the range of the Ortofon Bronze. I would be curious to hear your thoughts on MM carts in the affordable range, if you have one. "" Bob First off you mention Ortofon Bronze. Ortofon uses color name titles for almost all of its cartridge lines. They use it in most of their entry levels and their higher level cartridges also. Their TOTL carts. simply have names. Typically their cartridges named 'bronze' is reserved for their mellow sounding ones so if it were me, and using AR speakers, I'd say no to any of the bronze models. Their first up models like the 'Red', the middle 'Blue' and up tier 'Black' are in my estimation better suited for AR's as long as their follow-up behind is of equal caliber. But, let me start by saying that I feel whatever starts (cartridge) the chain of electronic sound should be at least as good as the end (speakers). When I first entered and late at that the world of computers, I was told by others more knowledgable than I that what goes into one is important to insure whatever comes out is as good or, AKA "sh_t in equals sh_t out". So for instance with a fotofile if the file is compromised due to poor quality, chances are one shouldn't hope for miracles in the output. Well, it's the same in high fidelity so, in my opinion if one uses a lesser quality phono transducer, (cartridge) the output transducer (speaker) will reflect the same, both should be virtually on equal ground. If you're considering to remain with 'MM' cartridges, the AT-440ML is a really good starting place. It's a 'MM' and doesn't require a step up transformer and will allow you to keep costs down. It will also assist in helping any AR speaker serve up a reasonable amount of high-frequencies which most AR's are noticeably deficient in doing. Though when I first purchased mine they were going for $80., I believe they're increased to about $180. presently. Be that as it may, I believe the classic-line of AR's sorely need a shot-in-the-arm of increased high frequency response so this cartridge is beneficial and addresses the dreaded AR sparse upper range. Like I've often indicated AR speakers are needy candidates for any help in the upper-frequency range and this cartridge is your basic answer. On the other hand, the low cost MC as I mentioned above is the route to take and a 'SUT' simply plugs into any 'MM' phono input of 47K with-out any further changes needed and presto, you'll have a more realistic and certainly more enjoyable listening experience. I chose the Cadenza Blue as it was more revealing than their lower priced Cadenza Red and outputs more high-frequency range that their higher cost Bronze as it is a touch more subdued in terms of high-frequency output and better with systems that have 'hot' sounding highs. The Bronze in the Cadenza line was probably introduced to answer the sometime upper high-frequencies of newer more modern sound of current equipment and therefore they've (Ortofon) charges more for it as it's more popular seller. Bear in mind that there are many more listeners of modern equipment as compared with vintage listeners. If you're an avid listener and appreciate having the option of achieving a higher level of listening quality, I'm almost certain you will eventually find yourself in the moving coil cartridge camp. Certainly there are less costly ways of satisfying one's listening requirements but, look at it this way. Life is short so, here's a toast to feeling good all of the time. Speaking for myself, I've typically starved myself of certain pleasures through out life and after I had realizations that I'm only getting older and have a limited time to feel good, from now on I will enjoy myself and music the best way I can. Good luck and if you have any cartridge questions, I will answer to the best of my ability of not being an expert but, an educated consumer who happens to have decades of AR speaker listening experience. I find vintage AR speakers as being an excellent platform on which to build a great listeners system providing one maintains an open eye, mind and ear to the present and future of any helpful additions to assist them. PS, I'm a fervent believer in absolutely clean and washed vinyl, anyone who isn't is in denial and chasing their own tail. Here's to feeling good all of the time! FM

Hi, when it comes to 'MM' cartridges, in 2012 I was still using a Shure Type IV with a new SAS stylus and at the same time I used a new Audiotechnica AT-440Mla and then upgraded(?) to a AT-150MLx. With-in a year I jumped into the 'MC' pool with not a lot of money to buy a new Denon DL-301II and a Denon AU-320 SUT and then I never looked back.There was no need to as the 301 II really impressed me to no end, or so I thought. I continued to soldier on and by 2015 purchased a Ortofon Rondo Blue, (now- discontinued) and a couple months later a Benz-Micro ACE S. Happy days were here again. Or, so I thought once more. Amazing how the human mind/ear always seeks more. By using the last two mentioned I began to see the light more clearly than ever before as both really were good to my music loving ears. So much so was I now super curious and I was inspired to jump-ship and into a Ortofon Cadenza Blue. Case in point, although it was a major step up and sounded excellent across the board, the Cadenza didn't show it's ultimately full potential in a SME 3009 Pre-Improved until I mounted it in a much heavier arm. That arm is the very rare Dynavector 505 where it impressed me even further and where it reached its full sonic potential. Not one to rest on my tonearm's arm-rest, in 2016 I elevated the whole shebang and dived in head first into a Lyra Delos which to this day still occupies a 'favorite' status for me. Later, side-tracking into a Lyra Kleos, which to me didn't have the exuberance of its less costly sibling, the Delos but, was just a touch too willing to please but in a more sedate manner so, I looked on. In 2017-18 after reading numerous positive test-reports I dove into the Audiotechnics ART-9 which amazingly seemed to almost be a near match for the Delos though not as excitingly sounding so. Being obsessed with the level of terrific sound and the welcomed complete uplifting of my entire system and musical enjoyment rendered by the afore mentioned cartridges I took another 'balls-to-the-wall' leap of fate to my present and probably as far as I go with expensive MC cartridges. So, I closed my eyes and felt the wind below my wings lifting me and my system to a place I only previously imagined and took flight with the glorious and 'too-fabulous-for-words' Benz-Micro, wait for it......... Wait-what? Yes-sire Bob, at its price level the astonishingly real and accurate sounding Benz-Micro "Gull-Wing" has few equals. I won't attempt to go on about this one as I know many couldn't fathom its more than words can describe brilliance, its depth and clear separation of instrumental notes and textures. Its glorious voice tones, its transient spontaneity and 'jump-up-out- of-your-seat' astonhishment factor. Additionally, its exuberance and completeness of leading and ending trails of notes and its revealing of the micro-edges of each note with harmonic completeness are seldom matched. Complemented by its maintenance and tidiness of notes there's no over-shoot unless the recording calls for it though, it does lavish us with the recorded hall-ambience and hall-echo that generally go unnoticed with lesser cartridges Oh, did I say I wasn't going to on about it? Pardon my self-indulgence but, my system's sound quality has elevated into a lofty flight more than ever because of this psychically tiny little winged item, the "Gull-Wing". I deserve all of this greatness of a superlative upper end vintage music system. So, here I remain knowing full well that I've probably reached the summit that my system can achieve. As I've said in another post weeks ago; the only other alternative is to spend huge dollars and forget the vintage world of high fidelity and move on to the 'new' world of current equipment by listening to a much 'higher-end' and costlier system. This is something I feel is not necessary presently as I'm quite content with my system and seeing the undo expense as just that, unnecessary. Besides, I literally have been building my system for more years than I care to mention although, I usually do(over 50 yrs.). No, this is not a new comers blindly thrown together assortment of 'stuff', I've actually cherry-picked each piece that I use, no low hanging fruit for me. I've found that when you use stacked AR-LST's combined with huge amplifier power, every added component must be on an equal level of greatness and sonic quality. When listening to the video below. providing that you have good size and quality computer speakers you'll notice that the 'bass' sounds big. The in room actually sound quality is that 'big' sounding. It not that music is coming from speakers across the room and all of the sound is only near the speakers themselves. This system easily fills the entire room with an equally large amount of sound that is quite breath taking to experience. I'm sitting approximately 15 feet away from where the speakers are. You'll see the tip of my shoe as I sit back down across from the turntables. So Bob, put aside a little money each week and strongly ponder the first MC cartridge I mentioned as the beginning of a newer, higher echelon and much more satisfying recorded musical place to be and get into MC. For about $700. (for both cartridge and SUT), I can assure you, you'll feel that you've made the right moves and all you'll be doing is listening and more listening but, on a higher level. Judicious 'set-up' is mandatory and will reward you ten fold. PS I, Why 'Stereofool' never mentions the Denon 301 II and only side-tracks readers with the constant mention of the lesser sounding and ubiquitous Denon DL-103, I have no idea. PS II, I too from the very first cartridge I bought back in late 1967, a Shure M3D and then upwards to a Shure M55, after, a M91ED and in 1974, a V15 Type 3, I can only smile knowing my journey of critical listening, of self-training my ears/mind in all those past years to reach an extent and level that a vintage stereo system can go to has paid off. And like I said, the only way above this level is by dropping huge sums of money that I feel is only O.K. if one has the disposable income and or is simply inclined to do so, apparently there are many out there who do. I am more than happy where I dwell and have reached my goal of personal stereo nirvana. In my life, I value music as being so signifiant and of such ultimate importance that I'm fully convinced that music and medicine are probably two of man's highest achievements on this planet. NOW, where are the other member's systems? Do they have the 'stones' to offer us all a small visual and audio glimpse of their set-up's sound or are they simply tinkerers who own old speakers and have stumbled onto the internet wanting to be part of a group? FM Below: Lyra Kleos MC cartridge, S.M.E. 3009 Pre-Improved tonearm, Technics SL-120 turntable, Denon AU-340 SUT. All set-up and tuned to perfection. Two restored Phase Linear Series Two PL-700 amplifiers driving four (4) AR-LST speakers, Carver C-4000 Pre-Amp, S.A.E.1800 parametric-equalizer, StraightWire interconnects, 12AWG speaker cables, room dimensions are 13 by 26, with 8ft.ceilings. Pardon the shakiness as I'm not use to holding a cell phone steady. Do turn the volume up for an approximation of in room sound quality. crop_jazz_joe_5-17-19.mov