Should I attempt to repair an AR3?

[JKent]

You ask a complicated question and other members will join in I'm sure.

The 3a is a collectible speaker so you should keep it authentic. Tweeters should not be much of a problem, since that tweeter was also used in the 2a. But you need to be cautious--some ebay sellers advertise tweeters that are for the 3, 3a, etc. The 3 and 3a did not use the same tweeter. Also--these tweets are nearing the end of their useful lives. Many "pop" their suspensions. A good solution may be to send your dead tweeter to CSP member Chris1this1, who has successfully rebuilt AR-3 tweeters

But if you have both tweets rebuilt (probably a good idea) it could run into a few bucks.. You "could" also use the Hi-Vi tweeter. Not original but it drops in and could be replaced later. https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/hi-vi-soft-dome-tweeters/hi-vi-q1r-1-fabric-dome-tweeter-116-mm-flange/

The mid is a problem. CSP member RoyC has repaired some so you might try shooting him a PM. The 3 mid is a monster--very heavy with tiny little leads. Do not use an aftermarket mid or a 3a mid. 

Hope this is helpful. On my own 3s with similar problems I converted them to 3a's but I don't recommend going that route. If I had known then what I know now I would have had Chris rebuild the tweeters and RoyC repair the one dead mid. Oh well. Live & learn.

-Kent

[Stimpy]

I'd try and get all the tweeters and mids rebuilt.  There's several speaker experts around the web, offering such services.  But if you do go with replacements, be sure to keep the stock drivers, for future resale value.

As to replacement tweeters, most recommend the Hi-Vi QR-1 tweeter.  It requires an additional inductor, but is supposed to sound very good.

Hi-Vi Mod

I'm not sure about replacement dome mids.  I'm not sure any exist?  If the mids aren't repairable, I'd use dome mids from AR91s or AR92s.  Then I'd pop the horn from the 91/92 mid, and replace it with the mesh screen and felt from the 3a's.  It should sound pretty close to stock (I think, I hope).

 

[barryjo]

What do you, as a group, think about me buying these supposedly OEM tweeters and mid range?

tweeter

and

Mid range

Just wondering.

 

[Stimpy]

The tweeters appear to be a better match for AR9's or 90s.  But maybe they'll work?  The mids look like the mids Ken Kantor designed for his AR303 design.  So again, maybe they'll work?  Unfortunately, not much else out there to choose from.

[JKent]

32 minutes ago, barryjo said:

What do you, as a group, think about me buying these supposedly OEM tweeters and mid range?

No and no

[DavidR]

They look more like replacements for the 9 Series speakers and not the 3.

[stupidhead]

17 hours ago, barryjo said:

What do you, as a group, think about me buying these supposedly OEM tweeters and mid range?

tweeter

and

Mid range

Just wondering.

 

so most everyone in this forum would likely be opposed to using anything but oem for this vintage speaker. using anything (not necessarily only your choices) not oem is blasphemy of sorts. I am firmly in the camp of oem, especially at this level of speaker. if we were talking about AR4x with ratty cabs as a set for the garage, maybe not oem, but I would still look for oem if they were mine.

these are worth the effort and resources to do correct.

[ra.ra]

18 hours ago, barryjo said:

What do you...think about me buying these ... tweeters and mid range?

I don't know anything about that $80 tweeter or $120 midrange you showed, but before you abandon hope of saving both original tweets and mids, I'd suggest you contact the members (who have already been mentioned in this thread) who have demonstrated success at resuscitating these aging and rare AR drivers. If all works out, it might actually be less expensive than purchasing new (or used) drivers, and it will undoubtedly be a more satisfying restoration experience and provide the best results.   

[genek]

These drivers are being offered as replacement parts for the 3a, not the 3. Even if they were perfect drop-in physical and electronic/sonic replacements for the 3a (which they are not, btw), you'd still need a crossover modification to put them into a 3. And then you wouldn't have a 3 anymore.

That said, there may be an argument for installing drivers whose performance you find acceptable if you can do their required crossover mods in a reversible manner, then storing the original drivers for reinstallation if you ever decide to sell the speakers. But if you're talking about doing a repair/restore and then flipping the speakers right away, anything other than original drivers is going to substantially reduce their resale value.

[JKent]

11 minutes ago, genek said:

if you're talking about doing a repair/restore and then flipping the speakers right away, anything other than original drivers is going to substantially reduce their resale value.

... Or sell them to a CSP member who will do a proper restoration.

[barryjo]

Given the riskiness of the restoration and the fact that I do not know what I am doing, I will probably sell them.

I think this might be a better idea.

[JKent]

Hey Barry

Some of your earlier posts sounded like you DO know what you're doing, and people here will help. But I understand--restoring these beasts isn't for everyone.

If you decide to sell there is a free For Sale section here. Just tell us where the speakers are and how much you are asking and maybe a CSP member will buy them.

OTOH, restoring speakers can be a fun hobby.

-Kent

[ra.ra]

5 hours ago, JKent said:

Some of your earlier posts sounded like you DO know what you're doing, and people here will help.

Yeah, with a little patience and some rigorous perseverance and a bit of humility and a lot of questions, you can handle this restoration yourself and really enjoy the learning experience. Lots of voices coming at you from all angles, but don't bail out yet. 

[hrbay]

wondering how it went for barryjo. After reading his nearly two year old post and thread, I can empathize with his plight, but many have gone through the curve on the 3's. He might have been able get enough info and bravery to find repair scheme for his mid.

       A replacement for the al tinsel wire with copper magnet wire was my start. The mids would click on a battery but only coming at the VC stub of wire, as the wires were a scrubby mess from previous repairs I think. Getting the wire lengths right took several shots in the dark due to the differing conductivity values of copper and aluminum, , but I got a good match on the one voice coil before doing the other one. OHMs only. Fixturing for centering the VC was done , but don't recall how I did it?  Also, silicone or de-airated urethane epoxy today might  be used to sub for the mids surrounds, I had no idea then or now what was used oem..  I used electrical grade silicone reduced a bit with acetone for mine. Still have the al wire in the tweets but ran low on gung-ho on rewinding them. The wires have been broken numerous times, and as there are small amounts of wire lost in each repair ,I have had to resort to field type repairs with thin copper strips crimped to the remaining stubs of magnet wire and flooding the joint with good solder. Not very engineered and not a job to be done after having a cup of coffee?but it worked.

     I recapped the old crossovers and did the pots along with new stuffing and non oem grill cloths.

    Listening to them right now from another room, but my hearing aid batteries are running low and chiming at me so anyway, I hope barryjo did get it sorted out. Let me go.  herbay

[Sonnar]

Check the pots and change caps in crossover: here are my AR 3 after a little restoration, including new mortite. Before they sounded very dull, one midrange and tweeters were mute. 

Very often the problem is on nonworking pots.

Best wishes

Adriano

[frankmarsi]

Eh piazzano, long time no here?

Set-up sounds good, I'm curious to know two things.

Number one, do you find that Carver pre-amp has made a positive difference in the sound of your set-up, which amp is that? Looks like a 'NAD'

Number two; how did you get the video to play with-out using U-tube, what video up-loader was used?

I've made numerous tries with-out U-tube but viewers must download file and can keep it, something I don't want to happen. I simple want the video to play with no downloading by viewers. Please send a private message if necessary.

 

[Sonnar]

Hi Frank, ciao! 

I 've been very busy late, two daughters graduating in law and in psychology, helping my wife in her business and my own business, that's enough to me...and sometimes I have fun times playing my eight AR speakers ! 

The Carver C1 is an excellent preamp, with a very good phono mm/mc inputs , very clean and neutral: I 'm so enthusiast that I m in serach of a PM 1.5 power amp, Bob Carver's machines seems very good to me .

I still use my Crown Macro Tech 2402 and the QSC ISA280, but last fall I bought this little BGW 6500T Proline II from a recording Studio, they used it with two Ampex tube mono preamp and JBL 4333b as monitors.

This tiny BGW is only 150 watts per channel on 4 ohms , and use hybrid Sanyo power modules , not a powerful brute, but what a fine sounding amplifier! Smooth, detailed richness of tones , silky but well extended on highs. 

I simply made a short video with my Samsung smartphone, saving on videos, and uploaded it , then I edited it with double-click option. 

All the best 

Adriano

[frankmarsi]

Thank you, I'll try it now. See new topic.

I'm glad that you're enjoying the Carver pre-amp, which one is it, 3300, or the 3500.

Carver's designs have since their introduction present a clean, almost crystalline quality to them with-out being harsh or grainy, just ask TAS.

Be it the pre-amps or the amplifiers as I' learned way back in 1973's Pink-Flyod's stellar introduction, the first time in the USA "Dark Side of the Moon" concert.

I was so captured by the life-like sound-quality that by 1974 and with a small loan, I purchased a Phase Linear PL-400 and I still have it. Mind you that the concert was in a huge out door arena powering huge banks of speakers. I easily knew that it would be the perfect amp for my AR-3a's. This months and two  months ago a few sentences were spent on the Phase Linear and innovations of original and Bob Carver's first amp, the PL-700 was heralded in glowing terms. They were the first to be able to power the AR-3a as it needed to be, or any AR speaker for that matter.

FM