ra.ra

Good news. Limit your morning coffee intake so you don't bung up those cabinets due to over enthusiasm.

lakecat, was it you that successfully "stripped" the stain from a pair of pine AR's not long ago? Whoever posted that project, it was an impressive restoration, and I cannot remember which speaker model it was. My feelings have been stated here before about stained utility pine cabinets, but this pair has been handled with a reasonably deft touch - - - i.e., they are not trying to replicate walnut. Because of the pine cabinets, and the rare woofers, and the seemingly excellent mid/tweet drivers, to me this is a very interesting pair of available speakers at a very attractive asking price. Grilles and badges?.....even better!

Those mids and tweeters appear original and look to be in fine shape. Woofers appear original, too, but it's a bit unusual to see the thick concentric damping ring on the cone of the woofer with the round ferrite magnet and stamped basket. This version of 12" woofer is not catalogued in the 3a restoration manual, but others will chime in with more specifics about this particular woofer. Cabinet front moulding appears to be stained birch or maybe cherry? And if your second pic shows a partial side view in the back right, maybe these cabinets are stained utility pine?

Hey Larry, that's a great story - - congrats on finding those rare speakers (wow....veneer on backside!). When you get a chance, tell us a little about the mids and tweeters, and of course, the cabinets, grilles, badges, etc. Too bad about those woofers being slopped up, but you'll get them back in good shape after proper attention. Trying to revive the cones seems to be the biggest challenge. According to product specs, the statement above about DCR is correct - - original factory range states 2.3 to 3.0 ohms. And Roy's comment about foam placement is also confirmed by 003 woofer drawing, which also shows 5/8" outside dimension on the woofer roll. I may be mis-reading your photo, but it appears that the foams have a radial splice which would suggest incorrect foam to begin with.

Before you begin buffing these up to attain the perfect finish, you really should repair that open corner joint shown in the pic posted on July 12. Also, be careful with the steel wool - - each of these drivers has a strong magnet that might tend to attract many of the loose steel fibers that will shake loose.

Hi Dan, and welcome to the forum. Those look like some very nice speakers and you'll find some good threads here about this model. You've got a very enthusiastic agenda planned for your restoration. That last one about building an "edge" frame has me a bit perplexed - - it will entail some careful detailing and forever change the appearance of these speakers, but it sounds like you wish to re-create the look of the earlier AR Classics? Did you get original grilles with this purchase? When possible, please post info and pics of the AR-8SE speakers, too.

I think the basic question you are posing will be understood here, but first you'll need to clarify specifically which mids you wish to compare. Your thread title is not consistent with your text: are you comparing the AR-3a midrange with the AR-3, or the AR-5?

That's exactly what I was beginning to get curious about. If you are certain that you have a dead one, it just might be worth a little exploratory surgery. Can you show us some comparative pics, including backside magnet and markings? If you do try to post pics, keep them small (100kb or so) and jpeg file format works well. Here is the tweeter with grille I mentioned - - nominal 8 ohms, made in Taiwan. https://www.parts-express.com/rt-6-2-phenolic-ring-tweeter-with-grill-8-ohm--279-462

Without seeing pics or specs for the drivers, it is hard to understand what this beef is about. The Ohm C2's midrange driver (see attached) - - which they refer to as a low tweeter - - is in fact some type of phenolic ring unit, according to their product literature. Simply Speakers and other sources sell various phenolic ring tweeters - - in fact, Parts Express sells a 2-inch PRT with a black grille (less than $7), which makes it look very much like the mid drivers used by Ohm. My understanding is that CTS first developed the phenolic ring tweeter; and soon thereafter, it was generically copied by other manufacturers (Marantz, BIC, etc). Even within a single manufacturer, all PRT's are not created equal - - I have an early cut sheet of some CTS drivers and within a variety of 1-3/4" PRT models, they have different magnet weights, voice coil diameters, driver depths, and power ratings. All of these have response range that begin at 2000Hz, but there is one 3" PRT that shows a response beginning at 1500Hz. The Ohm C2 calls their low tweeter a 2-inch driver, and the crossover frequency is cited at 1700Hz, so it seems quite possible to me that the Providence-purchased mid in your friend's C2's just might have been a suitable replacement driver that matched the original's characteristics , but without the protective grille. We would need to have more information to be able to make a final determination on this matter, but I did notice that there was no mention of deficient performance from the speaker with the replacement driver. According to my CTS brochure sheet, the 2T8 tweeter has by far the heaviest magnet, at almost 8 ounces, and the highest continuous power rating at 10 watts. Response range is noted as 2000 to 20,000Hz.

I've been trying to follow this thread, but I'll admit to getting a bit confused by now. This pair of Euro AR-5's appears to be a potentially excellent restoration project, so the level of frustration building up is a bit perplexing. You are receiving some excellent advice, but you need to take things slowly and begin with some deeper exploration and diagnostics. Not trying to add to the confusion, but just a couple random thoughts or observations I'll mention here. Re: your "dead" tweeter (with no AR logo), is it possible that your two exposed thin lead wires are in physical contact with each other? And about those midrange drivers: RoyC has already offered directive steps to determine whether these were originally intended for AR-5 or AR-3a, but also, don't these mids have push-on terminals for rear wiring? Same question for the working tweeter (with AR logo) - - are rear wiring terminals available on driver backside? Just my $0.02, but if three of the four small drivers already have the rear terminals, you might consider seeking a matching AR tweeter (or use two new Hi-Vi's) and proceed with this restoration to get rid of all that exposed external wiring and place it inside the cabinet where it really belongs.

And I know that many restorers prefer the dry material from the roll of foam strip. I tend to use the duct sealer, since it most closely resembles AR's original substance - - - plus I'm just a cheap b*st*rd. Each of the products recommended by Aadams will work very well.

Good updated report, Tom. Just like the 2ax model, I suspect that the early 2x had the simple square badge with black lettering, whereas later versions had the rectangular incised badge with red lettering (see pic). When you get these up and running, if you like what you hear, you may wish to invest in some of the fine linen replica cloth available from 1-2-3 Stitch. Regarding crossover, you will possibly find something that looks much like this one, with a 6uF cap for the tweeter circuit. This would be consistent with the cap value used for this driver when it is used in the AR-4 (tweeter) and the AR-2ax (mid).

Hey Tom, and welcome aboard. You are correct that the two-way AR-2x is not all that common - - it seems that most people that were shopping for an AR speaker that size with 10-inch woofer were willing to spend a few more bucks for the three-way AR-2a or AR-2ax. Nonetheless, the 2x is a very fine speaker, and I typically think of them as an AR-4 or 4x with a 10-inch woofer. The 2x was produced in at least two versions, as shown in pic attached. Early model had cloth surround woofer with tweeter from AR-4 (right): and later version had foam woofer with tweeter from AR-4x (left). I would presume that the cap values were different for their respective tweeters; possibly the coils were different, too, regarding different woofers. Tweeter controls may very well be your problem, so it will be helpful to show which type are in your speakers. And yes, in order to access the crossover, you will need to remove the woofer (4-screw or 6-screw). Please post some pics of your speakers - - from front, rear, and inside once you've disassembled. Keep pics about 100kb in jpeg format, and then you will get all the advice you need. This project will be a good training ground before taking on the LST/2's.

At first I suspected that the stands were not supplied by factory, but this catalog page confirms otherwise. I know I have never seen a photo of these speakers with the stands included (other than the original literature), but they should be fairly simple to replicate even without having the precise dimensions. More or less, the stands appear to be about the same height as the width of the KLH-1 speaker cabinet. http://www.classicspeakerpages.net/library/klh/klh-1_series_klh-1_klh-2_kl/klh-1_series_brochure/klh-1_series_brochure_pg5.html#previous-photo

Hello, and welcome to the forum. Which model.....KLH-1....or KLH One? Do you have any pics of the stands you are seeking information about? Each of these speaker models is pretty rare, even though they were produced almost 25 years apart.

Hey, that new Smaller Advent cabinet looks so good that you might even begin receiving orders for new pairs! That's some really fine work, and it's clear that you have the tools and woodworking skills to take on such an ambitious project. Not sure if this idea appeals to you, but at this point I would take advantage of the opportunity to ditch those silly little six wood/velcro stand-offs and find a more integrated method to attach the grille frame - - this is what I am doing with my recent resto-mod project. Thx for the heads-up on the Varathane product, too - - - I know MInwax makes a "gun stock" stain which is a very similar shade of reddish brown. Your KLH Twenty-Two's look very good, too - - - is that a different grille cloth from the one used on your Advents? And, in your very first pic where you show the old cabinet with new veneer, is that an AR-7 or a small Dynaco speaker lurking along the left edge of the photo?

Hey Henry, There is not much specific chit-chat on this site about Wharfedale speakers, but the members here have a great deal of knowledge about speaker design and construction in general. If you post pics (100kb size in jpeg format) of your problem areas, you're likely to receive some helpful advice.

That's a great description, thanks - - including the comments on caps and stuffing, too. Too bad about that one cross grain blow-out - - it's virtually impossible to create any appearance close to "seamless" in that instance with walnut veneer, but it looks pretty good. Looks like your woofer screw holes could use a little reinforcement, too. In any case, these things look so much better with real wood veneer - - maybe only the second time I've seen these speakers improved in this way. Nice work! This thread may prompt me to post my modified Smaller Advents from last year, which is sort of a poor-man's version (lazy man?) of your project. Edit: I've never used that "gunstock" stain but have read about it before, and it really suits my tastes to bring a bit of red hue to the walnut - - - it looks really good on your project.

Impressive cabinet work - - - looks so much better than new! Did you strip down to bare cabinets first, and could you describe veneer application? Also, just for posterity, maybe you can cite the cap values found in this pair.

Pic attached.

Format the images as jpeg files in the range of 100KB (not MB!) and upload is easy.

Making your own is a great idea, but these woofer rings (under surround or spider) do not typically use 1/4" thick panel stock - - - generically, the proper material is 1/8" tempered hardboard, as noted on this drawing for the 12-inch woofer. When installing, the rough side goes against the metal basket. Now we need to see pics of these speakers!

That's a pretty rare speaker model - - here's a little info that might be useful. https://www.audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/wharfedale-w80e.579518/

No headphone jack in this one, but last night I was reading an outdated New Yorker magazine and spotted this AR amplifier in a laudatory review of the work of avant-garde performance artist, Charlotte Moorman.

Hey Toomuch, Welcome to the forum, and thanks for resurrecting a thread that's been dead for nearly thirteen years. The 4x is a terrific small speaker, and when properly working tweeters are measured out-of-circuit, they should be closer to 4.5 ohms. RoyC's advice is excellent - - - most likely you have corroded pot controls - - - it's very possible that your tweeters are still functional, but you'll need to confirm that. (edit: I checked a few more of these tweeters, and they measured closer to 5.0 ohms.) Your "handle" immediately reminded me of this favorite tune which kicks in at the 1:30 mark after "Tequila". This audio is authentic musically, but sorry I was unable to locate vintage video to accompany the music - - nonetheless, it's still great fun to watch. This song is one of the several anthems shared amongst my youthful primal tribe. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKw0r0YBe_A