thornev Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 I am so bummed. I just bought a pair of AR-2Ax speakers (serial numbers AX 120075 and AX 90582) off eBay and here's what I got. Woofer blown on one, controls on back when you turn them sound like they are grinding something and the tweeter and mid produce no sound. On the other speaker no sound comes out of the tweeter and the same crunching noise turning the controls. I expect the controls would have to be replaced and maybe some of the speakers. Are these speakers beyond repair? That is, is it going to cost too much to repair them? Or is it better to find another pair for under $400? Thanks. Thorne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stupidhead Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 What is too much? assuming this is the set from your original post, or not, they are likely not beyond repair. The question really is whether it is worth doing! Your ebay link earlier suggested $425 for purchase/sold price. This is on the high end of cost, especially for not refurbished. Please note I said cost, not value. I (and likely many in this forum) have sunk more money into a set of speakers and likely will never recover the "cost" put into them. This does not mean that the value is not there in my opinion. What I am saying is, in the case of buying an old set of speakers in OEM condition and tearing them apart and refurbishing/replacing/refreshing all of the components is a tremendous learning experience, and when done you have an intimate relationship with them. Some will say you now own their soul. The 2ax model is a worthy model to have this relationship with. If you are looking to sell these after reworking then the equation is different. The 2ax is a great model and while I am not trying to encourage one way or another, there are a bunch of things to consider before making a decision. You claimed the seller was amenable to a return if you were not happy. Can you crack them open and further evaluate them and still send them back? If so, the first thing to do is verify all original components. You may have one cloth woofer and one foam surround woofer. You claim one is "blown", how has this been determined? In all cases do not put high volume to them at this point. On the controls (potentiometers here forward referred to as pots) the grinding you hear/feel is normal for a vintage set. Impossible to know if reversible until extracted but my own experience is that 3 out of 4 times a pot is salvageable, but if not replacements are easily found for pretty short money. The fact that some of the drivers give no sound is likely a direct result of these crunchy pots. You could try spinning them repeated times to try and get some contact internally but I generally don't draw any conclusions until I do a visual inspection and am able to get a signal (low volume) direct to each driver. Doesn't really answer your question but gives you a few things to consider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thornev Posted February 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 Thanks, stupidhead (Gee I hate addressing you that way)... The seller has given me a full refund. Long story but fair. So now I can do with them what I want. The woofer is blown because the grill fell off the speaker and when I move the woofer back and forth, it produces sound but very distorted sound. And I can feel the rubbing in the woofer. I've repaired speakers before so I know a little something about them. I want these speakers for my own so if I can restore them to their original, fabulous-sounding condition, I would be willing to do it. I've seen the schematic. Electronically, these speakers are not that difficult. I just restored a Fisher 500-C so speakers are easy comparatively. My fear is the cost of replacing the speaker components. I know the woofer in one is blown. That means buying one and knowing how to seal it since these cabinets require an air seal. I would guess the first thing to try is to replace the controls because they look and sound corroded. I tried turning them both ways several times and no change. Maybe the other speakers will produce sound if I fix the controls. I read in a thread about restoring 3AX speakers. Is there enough info in that thread with which to restore these 2AX speakers? If not, where could I go to find from where to purchase the components? PS - These are cloth woofers, not foam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stupidhead Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 is the good woofer a cloth surround or foam? there is no 3ax, but you likely mean 3a. go here for the restoration guide for 3a. much of it applies to the 2ax and others. 3a restoration guide Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thornev Posted February 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 Good news I guess. I've been twisting the controls hundreds of times and I do get a very quiet signal out of the tweeter and mid on the blown-woofer speaker. But in order to get the tweeter to work, I have to push in on the back control. So I think repairing the controls is number 1. I don't know what kind of woofer is on the other speaker. The grill is well-glued. So, do I remove the woofer to get at the controls? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidR Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 32 minutes ago, thornev said: Thanks, stupidhead (Gee I hate addressing you that way)... Yeah, especially since he is NOT a Stupidhead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thornev Posted February 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 Well, after turning the HI and MID controls thousands of times on the back of the good speaker, I'm getting sound out of all 3 speakers (woofer, mid and hi). So on this speaker it looks like just the controls need to be repaired. On the bad speaker (woofer blown speaker) doing the same thing I was able to get sound out of the mid but so far not the tweeter. On both speakers the controls operate on only a small portion of the full turn. When turned to other areas of the control, there is no sound from the speaker. Do I remove the woofer to get at the controls on these speaker cabs? Thorne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stupidhead Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 read this! getting the grilles off is essential. take your time so as to not damage the grill, cloth or cabinet! by the way, stupidhead is a term of endearment by my wife. most people call me Geoff after they get to know me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKent Posted February 6, 2018 Report Share Posted February 6, 2018 Hey Thorne You're getting good advice from Geoff. And your original question, "Are these 2Ax's beyond repair?" has been answered: No! Keep 'em! Sounds like you encountered a more-than-honest ebayer if you got a full refund. I was going to suggest asking for a partial. So study the 3a restoration booklet linked, then come back with more questions. Also have a look at this. It addresses removing the grilles on the 2a. Your early 2ax's may be attached the same way. http://www.mbzponton.org/n2awa/ar2a.html -Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thornev Posted March 18, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2018 I purchased the controls and caps from vintage-ar on eBay. I just installed all of it in one of my 2Ax's and wow ! They sound great. And it's nice to have working controls so I can tune in the mix between the 3 speakers. I'm going to redo the other speaker now. Psych ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thornev Posted March 28, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2018 I was reading another thread about restoring 2Ax's that some users, when they install L-pads instead of original pots, don't like the sound. As a remedy they install 25 ohm 10w resistors between 2 of the lugs on the MID control (or maybe it's the HI control). I don't see explained anywhere what it is about the sound that some users don't like. Can anyone explain it? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bad-monkey Posted March 28, 2018 Report Share Posted March 28, 2018 thornev: As it was just explained to me: the pots are actually imparting a parallel and series resistance simultaneously. And if you replace with L-pads you need to spoof the series (?) resistance by adding a resistor between the lugs. Failing to do so changes the x-over point. FWIW I'm in the same place as you, have a pair of 2AX's with gritty pots that needs a little TLC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thornev Posted March 28, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2018 Thanks, Monkey. I went ahead and purchased the 2 resistors. It's such a pain to reopen these speakers, but if it makes that much of a difference, it'll be worth it. I wish I could find an explanation about how different the crossover point is. I find the MID speakers seem to carry mostly high frequencies so maybe the resistors will bring the low end of the crossover to the MID down some. Thorne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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