Best AR and How Much..........

[Wally]

For the record, what are the going prices for the following AR speakers:

AR9,AR90,AR9LS,AR91,AR11,AR10pi,ARLST,AR3a, in good condition with all AR original or reconditioned drivers. No Modifications.

I moved to a new house and although I have a better setup for listening to hifi, the room is small 13 x 10. My LST's don't sound right in here because I'm guessing the outside drivers are too close to walls. My AR12's sound ok even on the short wall because they are radiating directly I assume.

I like the extended bass from the LST's compared to the 12's but I think I might be better off with front radiating speakers.

Are the series after the 9,90,91 as good as their predecessors? I think I would prefer an inline config a la 91/9/90 because I do like the localization this arrangement gives to instruments. I base this on my listening to my Paradigm Studio monitors and Celestion DL10's.

Both these speakers sound much bassier than the AR's in the same location but these are designed to be out in the room whereas the AR's sound better against a wall. There is not enough room in my current listening room for speakers that have to be out 4 feet from all walls.

Opinions? Comments?

ps What is the going price for midranges and tweeters etc? ie I want to compare the value of my LST's vs the component value.

Don't worry Bret, I would not consider selling them for parts but I am curious.

[ar_pro]

13'x10' is a very small room for the floor-standing systems - you might consider the 10pi, Wally.

[Wally]

You're right of course but I can dream about the biggies.

10pi,3a, 11 or 91 will probably be the choices but I would like to know what this will set me back. Haven't seen too much AR for sale in Canada.

>

>13'x10' is a very small room for the floor-standing systems -

>you might consider the 10pi, Wally.

[ToastedAlmond]

That info is all available at the Orion Blue Book website, or at the ebay site.

George

[Wally]

3.99 each item price..... kind of steep.....

DOES ebay haVE historical records except for the last few transactions. I don't think ebay is a very reliable indicator of market value.

thanks for the thought, Wally

>That info is all available at the Orion Blue Book website, or

>at the ebay site.

>

> George

[dynaco_dan]

>3.99 each item price..... kind of steep.....

>

>DOES ebay haVE historical records except for the last few

>transactions. I don't think ebay is a very reliable indicator

>of market value.

>

>thanks for the thought, Wally

>

>>That info is all available at the Orion Blue Book website,

>or

>>at the ebay site.

>>

>> George

>

Hi there

The top line seems to pop up, from where, I don't know where.

If you want an indicator of market value ebay is an indicator of sorts.

One item will sell for $100.00 one day and $1.00 the next.

You may just jump onto a pair of LST's at $400.00/pair and the next pair $1600.00/pair.

If you want something as a guide line, maybe higher than market prices, then The Orion Blue Book is at least still the same price after the ink dries. They don't change by the minute either.

I have seen, for example, Dynaco A-25 tweeters go for $9.00/pair and $61.00/pair on the same page of ebay.

The Blue Book does not mean that you will receive that much money for what you have or what you should necessarily pay as well.

Consider the items you want a value on, to be on the stock market, the prices go up and down as supply and demand dictates by the minute, hour and day.

You may choke and cough at what someone may offer you or really smile.

Six of one and half a dozen of another.

Good luck.

[ToastedAlmond]

With all due respect Wally, what would be a better CURRENT market gauge than the largest internet sales site in the world?

A member of another website that I frequent recently stated that the Koreans are buying up all the vintage AR they can get their hands on. If that is the case, the prices on ebay may be slightly inflated at this juncture, but until somebody gins up a website where nothing but AR gets sold, ebay is the best indicator you're going to get.

[rrcrain]

www.audiogon.com is another auction site that deals exclusively with vintage and high end audio. They have a history of generally pulling a a more stable price on audio gear than ebay does.

[Guest Bret]

>Don't worry Bret, I would not consider selling them for parts but I am curious.<

What, me worry?

I read this a long time ago and started to respond, then decided I wouldn't, then decided I would, then. . .

So in a moment of weakness I'm going to say something that may get me in trouble.

The 10pi, 11, 3a need to be listened-to further away than the 9 and 90 do. Why? Because while the driver layout gives them a very nice response in the far field, they just can't compete with a vertical driver array in the near field for imaging. NOTE: This is not a criticism of the 10/11/3a, it's just an observation.

I've never spent a whole bunch of time in front of a pair of 91s, but it occurs to me that if you can find a pair of 90s you can go get (avoiding shipping) there is no circumstance where the 91 is going to outperform the 90. If you ever move to a larger room the 90 will outperform the 91, but more importantly you'll get the 8" low-mid AR found necessary to produce their "flagship".

A 91 will give you more placement options (sorta - you still have to put it where it interacts with the room well), but the 90 will "automatically" decide for you "height" of the tweeter/midrange, etc, and will benefit from the side-firing of the woofers just like it would in a larger room.

So my vote would be that you thought about 90s. A pair of AR-90s in various states of repair might go anywhere from $100-400 (if eBay is any indication) and "refurbished" is a heck of a bargain.

I invite dissent.

Bret

[dynaco_dan]

Hi Bret

I wish to say thank you for speaking up.

If you didn't, then your valuable opinion and input would have not been heard.

Not everyone may agree with you, nor do they have to, but that's ok, at least we have dialog with another readers views.

Dialog, that's what's important, it keeps this web site refreshed with energy.

Have a great day.

Vern

>

>I read this a long time ago and started to respond, then

>decided I wouldn't, then decided I would, then. . .

>

>So in a moment of weakness I'm going to say something that may

>get me in trouble.

>

[Supercooper188]

Well all I can say is that the AR-90's are the best AR speakers I have heard. I have a pair of JBL L7 ($1000 ea)and they can not compete with the AR's. I thought it was me, but then I asked my 13 yr old son which speakers sounded the best and he said no doubt the AR's were clearer in the area of voice reproduction and separation of instruments. If you can get your hands on get a pair of 90's then you should. I have been particle to AR since a friend of mine introduced me to them in 1977. Over the years I have probably bought 12-15 pairs and I still have 7 pairs. I have never heard the AR 9's and I would guess they are better than the 90's, but it is hard to believe that you could find a better speaker than the 90's. Just my 2 cents--The 90's have sold me for life and I just got them a couple of weeks ago.

[rrcrain]

I've watched the price of the 9 and 90's as well as the JBL prices on Ebay and I'm amazed. JBL commands an amazing price even if the cabinets are in terrible condition whereas the AR9 and AR90 pull a pittance even if they are in excellent condition. To my ears, nearly every JBL I've listened to has a harsh tweeter that leaves my ears physically in pain. The only exception was a pair of JBL studio monitors I heard last night being driven by a 6 watt Grommes tube amp.

Overall, the 90 is one hell of a speaker and I've yet to find anything to make me want to part with my pair.

[Wally]

Thanks Bret. I appreciate your logical and experienced answer.

THe AR9's would probably be too much for my room. Take your word re the 3A,10pi and 11 requiring more distance.

The 12's sound fine at about 8' distance and they are about 8' apart.

Thanks to the rest of you for recommending the AR90's.

Anyone out there have a pair they want to sell or trade?

I'm near Toronto in Ontario so would prefer someone close...

regards, Wally

[Supercooper188]

I have made many deals in my life, but I think the deal I made on the 90's was the best deal I ever made in my life. I picked them up for $127, and I would not part with them for $2,000. It is hard to believe that someone would part with such a priceless item. The guy that sold me mine said they were his father's, but his father passed away. They needed foam replacement on 6 of the drivers, but I quickly replaced them in no time. Believe me--replacing the foam is not hard to do and does not require any special talent. Get you a pair of 90's and you will be smiling all the way to heaven.

[Guest Bret]

>Take your word re the 3A,10pi and 11 requiring more distance.<

Wally, I don't know how I get myself into these messes. I didn't mean to say that your room wasn't large enough for 10pi/11/3a. All I *meant* to be saying was that the 90 should sound better nearer the speaker.

You never said, or I've forgotten, how you characterized your room (dead, lively, overstuffed). In a real "live" room a 3a ought to sound wonderful (as wonderful as anything in a live room) and that ought to be plenty.

My 9s are in a room a little larger than you have and it is a colossal waste of the bass these things will produce. But the upper-range is nice and putting less "bottom" in the room isn't going to produce more bass than I've got. (had the same problem with this room and a single 12" subwoofer that shakes *other* rooms in the house, but you can't hear it or feel it in here)

I plan to move and make sure that where I go has a room big enough for these. A room that I'm welcome in at 11:00pm with thunder playing.

Bret

[Wally]

I am looking for a pair of any of the above with a preference for the AR90's if I get a choice. I agree with your suggestion. Makes a lot of sense to me.

I love that thundering bass also..... only when it's supposed to be there of course.

[Wally]

Well I finally found a pair of 58s. Just missed a pair of AR3a but I think these will do just as well and they have the vertically aligned drivers. Of course the woofers have to be refoamedand I am anxiously awaiting the arrival of the surrounds because my buddy who does the refoaming did not carry those.

I notice that these woofers have 'floppier' cones than the Tonegens I put in my LST's. They have the square magnets. pics attached.

Bret, I have ordered a pair of AR3a vintage woofers from Dale. As soon as I get them I intend to put them into the LST's.... that should put a smile on your face. I'll use the Tonegens in a future project. I'm also waiting for Shawn to get back to me regarding his unmatched pair of LST's. If I can acquire them I will also use them in some future project.

By now Vern should have received that first package of brochures and flyers. Shouls be some stuff there to add to the library. Then I'll send the next batch of brochures.

Still a small network to build for my Advents as per Pete B's research. Cold weather is coming... there'll be lots of time for projects.

http://www.classicspeakerpages.net/dc/user_files/687.jpg

[Kuja]

Hi,

You could also have considered AR98LSi!

They are similar in volume to AR10p/11/91/58, but are four way and they have that 8" driver found in AR9/90.

>>8" low-mid AR found necessary to produce their "flagship".

For me, they were the ideal compromise between size and sound quality... I also have a smallish room and AR9 would be too big for me

They are very shallow and wide, I their brochure they are described as "bookshelf" speakers and in my room they work well against the wall.

You can see the restoration job I did on them here:

http://www.kujucev.com/ar98ls/ar98.htm

For some reason, these speakers seem to be always overlooked on this forum...

After the restoration, I'm just amazed with them!

I'm also having comments from lots of people that visit my home that these speakers are awesome sounding.

On the downside, I paid an equivalent of 360$ for them (they are very rare in Europe) and invested additional 1440$(!!!) in the restoration... I just went crazy, but I believe that they are much better now than they were new

Aleksandar

[Wally]

Hi Aleksandar,

You did a terrific job both in renovating the speakers and in documenting your progress.

Congratulations I'll bet they sound as good as they look.

For sure, If I can find a pair of these I will try to acquire them. So many great speakers that this company has created over the years. I agree with you, Many of the AR's will give modern speakers a good run for their money.