New Ar 4x Owner

[Guest mce]

Hello All,

I've just joined the Classic Speaker Forum and have a few questions regarding a pair of AR 4x speakers I purchased last week from a garage sale here in Dallas, TX. They seem to be later models, serial #'s 43981 & 43993. They appear to have never been opened as all grill staples were intact and caulking appears to original. I fired them up and he pots were acting flacky with the tweeters cutting in and out so I moved the B connection to the 1 terminal as recommended by many posts. They sound great now.

My 2 question are:

The foam woofer surrounds are an orange/yellow color. I've heard a lot about later 4x's having foam surrounds but nothing about their color. Is this correct for these speakers?

When I removed the woofer, the brown tissue paper underneath pretty much disintegrated in my hands. I repacked it as best I could but does this serve an acoustical purpose or is it just to keep dust off the woofer? Again, I've read posts about it but nothing regarding it's significance. If it is important, is there a modern replacement material available?

Thanks in advance and for all the good information on this forum

MCE

[Carlspeak]

That orange colored surround is actually a fine weave cloth. Be very careful with it and it will last you many years. It may be in need of a light coating of sealant.

Roy C. who posts here alot here found a gasket sealer made by Permatex that works very nicely. It can be found at a local auto parts supply store. Do a search on Permatex.

The stuff behind the woofer is Kempac. It's a creped paper material used for packaging. AR used one or two sheets of it to keep fiberglass out of the back of the woofer area. You can replace it with a highly porous cloth or window screen material.

[Guest mce]

That orange colored surround is actually a fine weave cloth. Be very careful with it and it will last you many years. It may be in need of a light coating of sealant.

Roy C. who posts here alot here found a gasket sealer made by Permatex that works very nicely. It can be found at a local auto parts supply store. Do a search on Permatex.

The stuff behind the woofer is Kempac. It's a creped paper material used for packaging. AR used one or two sheets of it to keep fiberglass out of the back of the woofer area. You can replace it with a highly porous cloth or window screen material.

Thanks a lot for the info. the surrounds seem to be in pretty good shape with no obivous pinholes. The woofers seems to move in and out freely but the cloth feels a little stiff. Will the permatex treatment help or should I leave them alone for ther time being?

[Carlspeak]

Thanks a lot for the info. the surrounds seem to be in pretty good shape with no obivous pinholes. The woofers seems to move in and out freely but the cloth feels a little stiff. Will the permatex treatment help or should I leave them alone for ther time being?

As you wrote initially, they sound great. Perhaps you should leave the surrounds alone for awhile and just enjoy them. You would need a means to measure the woofer's box Fc to confirm if there are indeed any serious leakage issues. If you don't have that, then simply enjoy them.

The Permatex sealant will not alter the stiffnees you feel. It simply fills in many of the pores in the fabric surround.

[Guest mce]

As you wrote initially, they sound great. Perhaps you should leave the surrounds alone for awhile and just enjoy them. You would need a means to measure the woofer's box Fc to confirm if there are indeed any serious leakage issues. If you don't have that, then simply enjoy them.

The Permatex sealant will not alter the stiffnees you feel. It simply fills in many of the pores in the fabric surround.

Thanks again,

I swapped in the AR 4x's for my Dynaco A-25's (with Realistic QTA-770 reciever, Luxman CD player & Thorens TD 160 TT) and spent the evening listening to my favorite artist (Johnny Clegg- Juluka & Savuka and solo work) and the ARs sounded just as good or better. I'll keep the ARs as is and continue to enjoy them.

[JKent]

Welcome!

I too enjoy listening to Johnny Clegg through my AR4x's. Guess that makes 2 of us

btw--I think what you have there are AR4's, not 4x's.

Kent

[Guest mce]

Welcome!

I too enjoy listening to Johnny Clegg through my AR4x's. Guess that makes 2 of us

btw--I think what you have there are AR4's, not 4x's.

Kent

Now I'm a bit confused. The lable ond postcard on both speakers are intact and lt lists them as 4X's. Thay are the smaller 10x19x9 cabinet size. Do they appear to have earlier components?

[Carlspeak]

Now I'm a bit confused. The lable ond postcard on both speakers are intact and lt lists them as 4X's. Thay are the smaller 10x19x9 cabinet size. Do they appear to have earlier components?

Kent is right. Sorry I didn't pick up on that myself. What you have is a very early version with the flat screen-covered tweeter and cross-hatched cone, fabric surround woofer. A previous owner may have swapped out the original woofer and tweeter for older components perhaps? However, as you wrote before, regarding the staples and caulking, they seem to be intact. Maybe some of the more knowledgeable AR historians who visit here could shed some light on the serial numbers you provided.

What I do know is the later version, the 4x, has a 2.5 inch cone tweeter that has no screen over it and a foam surround woofer with no lines. Here is a link to a brochure in the CSP library that shows a picture of the 4x.

http://www.classicspeakerpages.net/library...mponents_9.html

Of course, what matters most is that you enjoy them.

[JKent]

I've never seen a 4, but I have 2 pair of 4x's. I "think" the 4 used a 2.5" tweeter that was also used as a mid in the 2ax (I have those too, and your tweets look like my 2ax mids). I've only seen the "hot cross buns" pattern on some KLH woofers, but the 4 may have used those as well. Funny that you have the 4x cards on the backs. Maybe the drivers were replaced. Beats me but it's hard to know the history of any given pair of 40 year old speakers. As Carl would say, it's all about the music, so how do they sound to you? If you love them, enjoy them. If you insist on tinkering with them (as most of us here do), you will find lots of help here.

With any luck someone who knows more about the 4 vs 4x comparison will chime in here.

Kent

PS Looks like Carl responded while I was typing this. Looks like we both came to the same conclusions.

K

[Guest mce]

I've never seen a 4, but I have 2 pair of 4x's. I "think" the 4 used a 2.5" tweeter that was also used as a mid in the 2ax (I have those too, and your tweets look like my 2ax mids). I've only seen the "hot cross buns" pattern on some KLH woofers, but the 4 may have used those as well. Funny that you have the 4x cards on the backs. Maybe the drivers were replaced. Beats me but it's hard to know the history of any given pair of 40 year old speakers. As Carl would say, it's all about the music, so how do they sound to you? If you love them, enjoy them. If you insist on tinkering with them (as most of us here do), you will find lots of help here.

With any luck someone who knows more about the 4 vs 4x comparison will chime in here.

Kent

PS Looks like Carl responded while I was typing this. Looks like we both came to the same conclusions.

K

Yes, I’d be really curious to find out more about these. They certainly don’t look as they have been ever opened before. The grills were held in very tightly with just 8-10 of the inch or so long staples. I’ve since tossed them out but I believe they were painted an off white color to somewhat match the grill cloth . I had to pry them out with a thin knife blade and pliers. They hadn’t been removed since first put in. If fact it was very hard to locate them as they were so well camouflaged by the grill cloth. I first thought the grill was glued on. I suppose though if components were replaced they could have used new grills. The black caulking looked to be original as well at least from photos of other AR’s I’ve seen. Here are photos of the back if that helps any.

[JKent]

I've checked with a couple of AR experts and they say your serial numbers and woofer suggest early production AR4x, but the tweets are AR4, so they were probably replaced. The REAL authority on this would be Tom Tyson. Maybe he'll weigh in on this and settle the issue.

Kent