Aadams
-
Posts
1,452 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Events
Posts posted by Aadams
-
-
10 hours ago, ReliaBill Engineer said:
And performance? Sound, characteristics, plots, tests?
Most of what you are asking for is spread across CSP, in the AR library section and in threads of discussion especially involving members, @tysontom@Steve F@RoyC@Carlspeak@kkantor and John O Hanlon. The best way to search for those threads is Google.
Regarding diffs between the 2ax cone mid and dome mids:
All I actually know is the 3.5" 2ax mid was originally used as a mid/tweeter in an early version of the AR2 series. Nobody back then seemed to care that a 3.5" speaker would become beamy at 4500hz. AR added the orange 1" dome to compensate for the beaminess of the mid above 5k, giving the 2ax a sound character akin to an AR3 and later, with updates, akin to the 3a/5.
The domed mids and tweeters were created by AR in the full range 3way speaker era, to eliminate beaming in the musical freq ranges, well before there were small cone drivers available that could deliver broad uniform sound power at lowest distortion across the middle freq band.
I think your project objective is worthy. You are certainly not the first to think about it. If you can devise a non destructive, fairly easy modification, using a modern cone or a dome and maybe even a HiVi tweeter to make a 2ax sound much like an AR5/3a/11, it could be blueprint for others to inexpensively resurrect dead or dying 2axs. You will need some way to tie your results back to an AR source.
The late member @Zilch , inventor of the Econowave, had a 2ax mod that involved sawing out the upper half of the front baffle and changing the crossover to accept a wave guide and compression driver. Those discussions are probably in kitchen.
Adams
-
Pictured below; the earliest AR3 mid at top left and the first two AR3a mids bottom left and right.
-
I thought you would have an answer by now. Those Poly cones and rubber surrounds can be damp wiped with soap and water solution on a sponge. First I would use a vacuum cleaning brush if you have it, instead of a nozzle. Back up would be a soft bristled paint brush to stir up the dust sucked into a vacuum nozzle held at a safe distance . I wouldn't touch domes or dust covers on drivers because they appear undamaged. For the bent tweeter dome I would first try to gently, persistently, pull it out with premium duct tape. The premium tape is much stickier.
-
14 hours ago, ReliaBill Engineer said:
it’s actually at 1:14-1:16 primarily in the left channel
At 1:16 there is definitely something non-musical going on in the right channel of the streamed version. It doesn't matter.
This thread is drifting. The topic is your mod and its effect on the 2ax. Your stated goal is to move the 2ax sound toward the AR5/3a by replacing a cone with a dome. At this point all we have to go on is your ear. There are no objective measurements. There is not even an AR domed 3 way in the house to compare volume matched sound from the same speaker and listening positions when you record with a telephone mic. We need more than your subjective hearing memory of the "AR sound".
At one point you also wrote, you would be making a mounting plate to a achieve a non destructive fit in the baffle board with the grill installed.
I have no doubt that what you can hear, and we cannot, is pleasing to you but this is still a rough mod that, without further convincing evidence, we should be talking about in the Mods and Tweaks forum.
-
1 hour ago, genek said:
your impression that the first video (which we now know is "before") sounds better than the second ("after").
I checked my work. There is a noticeable difference. I prefer the first to the second. You can hear the difference using iphone earbuds. You don't need over ear headphones.
PS There is no stand noise in the digital version of this album at 1:30 in Hello Dolly.
-
45 minutes ago, ReliaBill Engineer said:
If you *looked* at the videos, you’d see the stock midranges on one video vs the domes on top of the cabinets in the 2nd video..
I did look/listen twice. What you say is not obvious because we never see the stock mids or the dome mids in the first video. The camera was stationary. You panned the scene in the second video, showing both speakers with domed mids on top and cone mids in place.
I think I said your first recording sounded better than the second. They do sound similar but in a low-fi way, not at all what you say you are hearing. We, on the forum, have no objective reference from which we can agree or disagree that you have achieved your objective of making an AR2ax sound more like an AR5 or 3a.
Do you have an AR5 or 3a that you could record side by side with your mod 2ax.
Also, why is this discussion not in Mods and Tweaks?
PS I agree it is not an electric bass but a closely mic ed string bass.
-
13 minutes ago, ReliaBill Engineer said:
How can anyone make a comparison of changes made, using 2 entirely different tracks?
Both are Chattanooga Choo Choo using an electric bass. Is it not from the 1965 album image you pasted? That is the one I streamed for comparison.
-
43 minutes ago, genek said:
Did you think one sounded better than the other, or were they just "different?"
The video on top sounds more full range and less tinny than the bottom one. Neither has the sound quality of the streamed version. I am not sure the phone mic is capturing what we are supposed to hear.
-
39 minutes ago, genek said:
But since both videos sound identical,
I thought the same thing until I listened on headphones and they clearly sound different. While I was using the headphones I decided to stream a 256AAC version of the same music to get a good idea of how the track is supposed to sound.
-
Why are there two videos presenting the same track from the record?
-
19 minutes ago, genek said:
Modern electronic music often goes to down to 20Hz.
True. If you have library of dubstep or trap music as well as esoteric pipe organ you need the right speakers. Otherwise almost all music occurs above 40 hz and speakers that begin to roll off at 40hz are all that most folks need.
-
1 hour ago, Norman Nicolai said:
Isn't "Coherent Source" the whole idea behind Jim Thiel 's design and introducing a subwoofer into the mix erases the entire "Coherent Source" concept.
Almost all of the coherence is in the tweeter and mid.
I would try a working equalizer for $350. A subwoofer with software management to simplify the blending at 70hz will cost a good bit more. The specs say the Thiel equalizer provides bass boost that is almost flat down to 20hz. Those are some special 10 inch woofers if they can take that kind of punishment but it also has a 40 hz cutoff. At 40 hz, they have roughly the same extension as a Large Advent or AR 91. The lowest note on a four string bass is 42hz. 5 string electric bass is 32hz. Concert Grand Piano 28hz.
-
Below: Two versions of Bolero that are very good, stylish, recordings made about 40 years apart. Both adhere to Ravel's instructions for tempo and dynamics,i.e. length about seventeen minutes and loudness to span the softest soft at the beginning and slowly build to the loudest loud possible at the end. Either recording will help you tweak your ear, system and listening space for dynamic range.
The music begins with a single pianissimo snare drum and ends with a fortissimo orchestra. The challenge is to set your volume control at the beginning so you can hear the drum without needing to turn down the gain as the loudness relentlessly builds to the climax.
-
41 minutes ago, Norman Nicolai said:
Do I absolutely need the Thiel equalizer for them to work as intended?
No. You could use a single good quality 12 inch sub woofer instead and the Thiel woofers would be less stressed than using the original electronic subwoofer/equalizer which operated below 70 hz.
-
I would repair it on the back side with a narrow strip of high count cotton attached with the least amount of flexible fabric adhesive possible, then dope on the front side with RoyC goop.
Can't recall seeing a repair like this in the forum.
-
Does either arrow point to the damaged area?
-
Did you see this review? He grudgingly admits the 530 is a really good speaker but too flat for his personal tastes without equalization. Graphs show it is perfect for your application. https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/jbl-studio-530-speaker-review.12298/
-
12 hours ago, ReliaBill Engineer said:
no idea how/why this ended up in tweaks and mods
I think because you wrote the following. Your intent clearly is not to preserve or restore the 2ax designed performance and appearance.
On 7/23/2023 at 1:40 PM, ReliaBill Engineer said:They aren’t a drop-in replacement, so I’ll have to modify the faceplate to fit in the existing mount hole in the baffle.
On 7/23/2023 at 1:40 PM, ReliaBill Engineer said:My goal is to make these sound very similar to the early AR-3a’s.
Not saying your project isn't worthwhile. If you devise a credible solution that is not too complex or destructive you could have a hit on your hands.
The third most visited thread on this site, with 44k views, is about modifying the AR4 to improve its sound. First is ADS 1590 maintenance and performance. Second is AR3a RESTORATION.
You might include this driver as a candidate. It would be readily accepted as credible. There is plenty of speaker engineering talent here, you haven't yet heard from, that could offer advice on the electronic adaptation. When used in the AR9 or 90 it covers the 1200hz to 7000hz band, very close to what you are trying to cover. When used in the 10 inch AR92 it covers 700hz to 7500hz.
Adams
-
Looks like the pixie dust spreader has seen this thread.
-
The above post would be a good beginning post for your mods and tweaks thread.
-
These random thoughts may apply equally to other music genre recordings but my focus lately has been on Classical Music.
I never thought I would rent my recordings instead of purchase them but it looks like I am trending in that direction. There are a lot of advantages but the three big ones are 1. ability to entirely, repeatedly, listen to a recording without buying 2. The option to purchase CD or Higher Res files at below CD prices, 3. The monthly access fee is less than the cost of a new release Classical CD. I haven't purchased a new CD for several months.
The classical music recording industry is mostly cover bands trying to create definitive versions of music from way back. Every substantial change in recording technology spawns a wave of re-recordings of standard repertoire because the industry knows the audience will buy multiple versions of the same music in the hope that a definitive combination of interpretation, performance and engineering will emerge to replace the previous best effort. Traditionally, critics and reviewers would help steer you to the next best thing.
The best streaming libraries are vast. You can do your own comparisons and discover there are real qualitative differences in classical recordings across generations of technology as well as within the generations. Some old recordings still hold up well but many recent captures for Hi Res release offer stunning quality, even at CD bit rates. That is not to say Hi Res versions are always best or even better.
The incremental price for this improved listening experience is low compared to most system upgrades and can make a lot of sense if you still purchase recordings.
Of course the only convenient way to play Hi Res files is to have a robust internet connection to a computer, of some kind, and maybe an outboard DAC . The entry cost is about the price of a pair of good speakers but the incremental cost of the music is low and is significant tweak. -
Have you tried switching the polarity of the connection at the rear terminals of one speaker cab?
The LMR does not operate in the range of bass that you seem to be missing?
What degree of equalization do you have? Graphic equalizer or Pre amp Bass and Treble, for example.
-
I am not sure anyone here has an answer for you. Modifying your 2axs to sound like your Polks will not be considered an achievement on this site. You could use a 15 band equalizer and nearly accomplish the same thing.
-
On 7/18/2023 at 4:34 AM, blanddawg625 said:
suggestions on in between.
The P2200 shows up as a product of the 1970s to 1980s. Not many members here will encourage you to use an amp that old unless it has been professionally rebuilt. There are many modern 4ohm capable amps with speaker protection circuitry but there will be zero additional AR90 woofers and LMRs.
AR55BX Bass drivers
in Acoustic Research
Posted
Check this link.
Page 28
http://www.classicspeakerpages.net/library/acoustic_research/original_models_1954-1974/original_models_schematicss/restoring_the_ar-3a/restoring_the_ar-3a_full_pd.pdf