DavidR Posted March 5, 2014 Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 I was able to get a pair of TSW-610 speakers pretty cheap and in very good condition except the surrounds are all dried out and beginning to fall a part. The guy I bought them from had them in their original boxes for the last 10 years.I played them gently for less than 2 minutes just to make sure they worked. The tweeters seemed a bit low in volume but hard to tell as I didn't have the volume up much.I started to clean off the old surround from one of the mid drivers. The mids and woofers have poly cones. The glue has proved to be a real b---ch to clean off. I may not want to do the refoam job myself any longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafia1976 Posted March 5, 2014 Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 Hi David, my first AR speakers were the spirit 162 & also have the poly cones. I used car brake cleaner as it softened the glue & came off very easily. I applied it with a cotton bud & then used a sharp craft knife to scrape it off, I found the poly cones easier to clean than the drivers on my AR9's to be honest. I hope this helps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidR Posted March 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 Oh boy does that help! - Thanks so much.Does anyone know of a replacement gasket/sealer material for the drivers. This material is a thin rubber/plastic material, approx 1/4" wide, double stick sides (very sticky). The drivers mount flush on the speaker cabinet face (not countersunk). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafia1976 Posted March 5, 2014 Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 No problem at all glad to help. As for the gasket I'm afraid I don't know do you have a photo? Where about's are you? I'm in the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidR Posted March 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 I'm in Massachusetts, west of Boston.I'll see if I can upload some pictures Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidR Posted March 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 Here are a few pictures:The first driver 98% cleaned. The brake cleaner made it easier; but still troublesome. There was a paper 'gasket' on the steel frame below the surround. I hope this was suppossed to be cleaned off as well. Half of it came off with the surround anyway. I still need to do the dust cap but I'm waiting for the surround kits as it is supposed to come with solvent that will dissolve the glue.Here is a picture of the woofer gasket material>>> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafia1976 Posted March 5, 2014 Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 Looking good!! It makes it all worth while once they are back in & as good as new. You could try a local craft store for the foam gasket, I'm lucky enough to have a friend who owns a foam/packing company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidR Posted March 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 I think its either rubber or plastic with double sided sticky adhesive.Does anyone know about the cardboard gasket that was under the surround on the speaker basket frame and if that needs to be replaced? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafia1976 Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 If it was between the foam & basket it needs to be replaced. I could be wrong! but if it's not replaced & you apply new surround the cone will be sitting lower than it should be & may cause damage. Do you have a pic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidR Posted March 6, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 No pics of the cardboard gasket. I just ordered new surrounds and it may come with the new one. As of now the speaker frame and the edge of the cone are at the same height. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidR Posted March 8, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 I spoke with Vintage-AR, the supplier of the new surrounds. He says the old cardboard gasket is supposed to be removed.I should have the surround kits middle of next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafia1976 Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 That's good news then. My 12" woofers had a Masonite ring & my ar 6 had a cardboard rings both of which I left on & attached new surrounds. I look forward to seeing the finished speakers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyC Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 I spoke with Vintage-AR, the supplier of the new surrounds. He says the old cardboard gasket is supposed to be removed.I should have the surround kits middle of next week.David,I do most of Larry's (Vintage AR) woofer repairs, and he may have misunderstood your question. Generally speaking, surround mounting surfaces such as masonite and cardboard rings should not be removed, as they do have an effect on the height of the cone in the basket. IF, however, the mounting ring is very thin, it is often not critical to the normal operation of the driver.The earlier 12 inch AR woofers have rather thick masonite mounting rings, which must be retained to mimimize the possiblilty of the voice coil bottoming out.Roy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidR Posted March 8, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Hi Roy,Thanks for chiming in.I just got the kit and indeed the instructions say that it should not be removed. I don't suppose this is an item Larry sells? (I just shot him an email).I am confident I can cut one from some gasket material as I know the O.D. and I.D. I just need to see if I can get a measurement of the thickness from the other mid. I figured out how to remove the old foam without damaging the cardboard ring.Roy, you wouldn't happen to know the correct thickness for the cardboard ring?Any words of wisdom on removing the dust cap from the poly cones? Correct solvent to dissolve the glue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyC Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 Hi Roy,Thanks for chiming in.I just got the kit and indeed the instructions say that it should not be removed. I don't suppose this is an item Larry sells? (I just shot him an email).I am confident I can cut one from some gasket material as I know the O.D. and I.D. I just need to see if I can get a measurement of the thickness from the other mid. I figured out how to remove the old foam without damaging the cardboard ring.Roy, you wouldn't happen to know the correct thickness for the cardboard ring?Any words of wisdom on removing the dust cap from the poly cones? Correct solvent to dissolve the glue?I don't recall exactly how thick the mounting material is under the TSW surrounds (probably 1/16"), but it is inevitable that at least some or all of it will get removed in the process of removing that really nasty, sticky old glue. Don't worry too much about it. With these drivers I believe the height should be adequate without the ring. Use the friction of the shims to adjust the cone height to make it easier to glue (another advantage of using shims).Any solvent that removes the dust cap glue will also damage the poly cone. Sometimes you can get under the lip of the dust cap with the tip of an Exacto knife and lift it up. If not, you will have to cut and discard it. The felt dust caps in your kit will work as adequate replacements, but there are sources for poly dust caps if you want to stay with the original material.It has been a awhile since I worked on a pair of TSW poly cone woofers. The last time around I actually dismantled (4) 12 inchers for Larry, and replaced the cones, spiders, voice coils, and surrounds to convert them to standard AR woofers. (There doesn't seem to be much love out there for the TSW series.) I've attached a photo of one of the conversions.Roy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidR Posted March 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 Thanks for the advice Roy.My goal is to replace the (horrid sounding) Polk RTA12C speakers I got for my son.The brief listening we did with the 610s we could both tell the TSW were better sounding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyC Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 I'm sure they will sound quite good when you complete your repairs. Keep us posted! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlspeak Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 TSW stands for "Titanium Solid Wood". Seems this line of speakers was born from the marketing department. The solid wood makes up the top and bottom platents. The rest of the cabinetry is MDF. So, the only real sonic 'improvement' (and that's debatable) is the inclusion of a titanium domed tweeter. The bad news is these tweeters failed a lot down the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidR Posted March 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 For a $50 I was willing to take a chance. Anything so I don't have to listen to those Polks.I've seen nothing (yet) to substantiate their original $1000 each price tag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidR Posted March 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 Oh yea!Another surprise - double dust cap and it appears to be glued. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyC Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Second dust caps are often found on AR 8 inch woofers. The only difference between many of the AR 8 inchers are the dust caps and resulting different part numbers.Roy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidR Posted March 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 After I got my new surrounds for the mids I placed one on the mid that still had the cardboard gasket and the other on the mid that had the gasket removed. It was evident that the foam sat better on the mid that had the gasket. I measured the thickness and went and bought some 1/32" thick gasket material and cut a new gasket.I then glued it to the midAll I can say is the glue dries fast and is unforgiving quickly. I used a small brush to brush the glue on. When I do the surrounds I'll try the squeeze bottle that came with the kit. Hopefully that will allow some time to move the foam into place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidR Posted April 7, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 Been out of commission for a while but had made some progress before hand. Cleaning the old glue is tedious and time consuming. I wasn't happy with the results of the first woofer surround so I removed it. I need to order another kit to complete the project once I am up to it. The glue dries very fast and is unforgiving. I think the mids came out good and my second attempt on the woofer looks good, too.So far I've seen no justification for these to have retailed for $1000 each back in their day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve F Posted April 7, 2014 Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 "So far I've seen no justification for these to have retailed for $1000 each back in their day."They weren't $1000 ea.The 910's were $1000 ea--that was the 9-type tower, with dual 12's, an 8, dual 6 1/2's and the 3/4 titanium dome.I think the 610's were $500 ea. That's more appropriate to their performance.Steve F. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ra.ra Posted April 7, 2014 Report Share Posted April 7, 2014 Early AR speakers were typically priced per speaker, but perhaps this 80's TSW series was priced and sold per pair. This normally-reliable chart is a bit confusing on this issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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