ninohernes Posted June 13, 2005 Report Share Posted June 13, 2005 Are the AR-3a tweeters from AB Tech fluid cooled, or are they "dry" like the originals? I bought two for a pair of AR-3a's that I am restoring and I was just curious. They sound great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mluong303 Posted June 13, 2005 Report Share Posted June 13, 2005 I had ordered them from AB Tech and used them for direct drop-in replacement for many years. They sound very good and are the best replacement AR-3a tweeter (4 Ohms) available if you don¡¦t mind the expensive cost. The last batch I bought was around 1991 and the tweeter has foam padding glued on the face plate. These are Ferro Fluid filled for higher power handling. The unit was well build to AR spec by Tonegen in Japan. I had seen the later production model with bare face plate which you may have to call Carlos up to confirm if they are still made in Japan or other Country? Ferro Fluid coated voice coil or not? Let Us know once you find out the latest info.There are many fine sounding and well built tweeters made by Audax of France, Morel of Israel, LPG of Germany and SEAS of Norway. Many of them cost around $30-$40. I wish the more technical oriented experts in this Forum should look into it and find out the proper answer if we can purchase these tweeters ( 4 Ohms, 6 Ohms or 8 Ohms ) for our beloved AR speakers. What would be the correct Caps and coils value to take care of the modification to well matched the tonal balance of the original AR sound? Making the step down rings to fill up the big opening is the least of the problem in this process. I would not recommend expensive Dynaudio drivers since Dynaudio had stop selling drivers to the general public after they start to market their own speaker lines 5 years ago.Minh Luong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mluong303 Posted June 13, 2005 Report Share Posted June 13, 2005 Correction. The last batch I bought was 2001.Minh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninohernes Posted June 13, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2005 Well that is good to know! The original AR-3a tweeter was so fragile. I like big amps, but I hate to blow tweeters! That big old woofer needs the power, and its nice to know that the new tweeters can keep up with the woofer now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyC Posted June 13, 2005 Report Share Posted June 13, 2005 Hi Minh!I had purchased Tonegen tweeters from AB Tech in the mid 90's and as I previously posted, did not like them as much as you and Joe apparently do. What "AR spec" did Tonegen use? For example, the newly added AR parts list in our Library from the late 70's clearly shows different tweeters for the '3a versus the AR-11 and AR-10pi. Why didn't AR just specify the '11 and '10pi tweeter as a replacement for the '3a tweeter if one tweeter can do it all?The "Tonegen" type replacement may be a good tweeter. It is the best available because its the only true replacement available, but its sonically different than the original '3a for those who care about that. My only point in the past has been that it would be nice to have a better replacement for the '3a tweeter that does not require adapter rings or crossover modifications. A tweeter any of the large number of non-technical AR-3a owners with no wood working skills and/or electronic aptitude can screw into their cabinets to regain the original sound. A reasonable cost would just be a bonus. If the AB Tech replacement is good enough, why bother with crossover and cabinet modifications which will diminish the value of our antiques? The cost of the tweeter becomes irrelevant at that point.With that said, I thought the tweeter was OK when used with the AR-3a Limited crossover. I have since passed the tweeters on to another forum member for his evaluation.Roy C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninohernes Posted June 13, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2005 I just tossed the AB Tech replacements in the cabinet with the original AR-3a crossover. They do sound different than the originals, but they certanly do not sound bad, and they are a good alternitive to hunting around for originals. Whenever possible, I like to keep these speakers original. My AR-2's, AR-3's and AR-4x's are all original and I love them that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnieo Posted June 13, 2005 Report Share Posted June 13, 2005 Minh and Roy:Do we have one replacement driver, or two? I was told that AR originally asked Tonegen to manufacture tweeters to their specification. Is that tweeter the same tweeter AB Tech would sell today? Are we comparing tweeters from different sources or years of manufacture? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyC Posted June 13, 2005 Report Share Posted June 13, 2005 Agreed, Joe.Roy C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyC Posted June 13, 2005 Report Share Posted June 13, 2005 Hi John,When I purchased mine, I was told that they were the AR-3a replacement tweeter. I later saw what looks to be the same tweeter offered by Simply Speakers as a replacement for many models. It can still be viewed on that website with that description. Maybe Minh can offer some insight as he has experience with more of them.Roy C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mluong303 Posted June 13, 2005 Report Share Posted June 13, 2005 Hi, JohnAs far as I know. AB Tech Services is always the exclusive AR parts distributor in the U.S. There is only one Tonegen AR-3a tweeter up until the sponge padding faceplate tweeter as shown in picture below. They are coated with Ferro Fluid voice coil for better power handling and slightly better efficiency. They may have the ending part number different due to different batches.People who love the original recess AR-3a tweeters sound will have a hard time to adjust to the AR-10Pi and AR-11 tweeters sound. If you can not adapt to the AR-11 sound, very likely you will feel the brand new AR-3a Limited tweeters sound is difference as well. To my ears, the Tonegen AR-3a tweeters offer cleaner and louder compare to the original AR-3a tweeters. You can always cut back but you will never be able to get more if the tweeter is performing at its loudest! Good or better is all base on your hearing and personal preference as well as the type of music you are listening to… Also the hard paper dome with piston motion is different from the soft coated fabric dome tweeter in physical property as well.Minh Luong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyC Posted June 14, 2005 Report Share Posted June 14, 2005 Thanks for the insight Minh....I personally like the original AR-3a sound. Even if the Tonegen tweeter is only "slightly" more sensitive, it extends much further into the midrange than the old '3a tweeter. That is why it only has a 4uF cap and is cut off with a .16mh coil in the AR-3a Limited crossover. Even in the AR-11 it is tempered by a .10mh coil. The original AR-3a has nothing but the 6uF cap and no inductance across the terminals. Cutting back on the original '3a level control to tame it cuts the high frequencies too much. I guess it just throws the balance of the original '3a off too much for me.If I wanted AR-11's, I would try to find a pair of those to restore......so, in my opinion, we're back to needing a "more appropriate" AR-3a replacement tweeter.Roy C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninohernes Posted June 14, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2005 >so, in my opinion, we're back to needing a "more>appropriate" AR-3a replacement tweeter.>>Roy CA agree. It would not be that hard to do. Just a few things need to be changed. Question: Does the addition of ferro-fluid change the sound of the tweeter? It would be great if there was a tweeter exactly like the original, but had better power handling ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bret Posted June 14, 2005 Report Share Posted June 14, 2005 >so, in my opinion, we're back to needing a "more appropriate" AR-3a replacement tweeter.<Roy,I’ve tried to broach this subject (gently) with a few people who might be in a position to do something about it. Nobody seems to be interested. We're dinosaurs. Our speakers are dinosaurs. Our listening preferences are so last-century.Much better to have "lifestyle" speakers in neon colors with interchangable cabinet cozies of varying designs to fit our mood: Gothic Black with piercings; Fuzzy Confused with "Likeohmygod" printed in rainbow colors across the front; or the professional sports team of your choice's logo complete with the star player's wrap-sheet and bobble-head doll that bobs along with the beat . . . wirelessly, from your "CD quality" MP3 player.Have you seen the ads for the TV with the ambient light that changes color depending on the dominant color in your program material? The 21st Century needs a big, red, flashing sign on it : Abandon All Hope, Ye Who Enter Here.Bret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyC Posted June 14, 2005 Report Share Posted June 14, 2005 Dear ARasaurus Rex,Screw the tweeters! Ear drum adjustment controls can't be too far off...Besides, isn't Mr. Villchur in the hearing aid industry now? That guy has always been one step ahead of us!Roy C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bret Posted June 14, 2005 Report Share Posted June 14, 2005 >Does the addition of ferro-fluid change the sound of the tweeter?<Joe,My understanding is that the addition of ferrofluid does change the motor by changing the way the voice coil interacts with the magnet structure. I read all about it. . . somewhere. . . made perfect sense. But what I was trying to learn was the answer to the question you asked; The answer is, "Yes."Bret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bret Posted June 14, 2005 Report Share Posted June 14, 2005 >Ear drum adjustment controls can't be too far off<Brilliant!Bret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Americain Posted June 14, 2005 Report Share Posted June 14, 2005 And don't forget that all these new "high fidelity" gizmos must do everything for you. Light the candles, brings flowers and give us all that oh-so-realistic THX sound. If it's from the movie theatre it has to be good, right? RIGHT? *barfs* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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