Is it possible to fit 11" AR speakers to 10" cutout

[draftingmonkey]

I have a pair of AR-2ax's that have a pair of 10" Toshiba speakers installed. I recently picked up a pair of 10" AR speakers for replacements. Low and behold they have the 11" frame (AR stamped from April and June of 1968) and the speakers cabinets have a recessed cut for the 10" frame. The speakers came from 2 different sources. One parting out a 2ax the other a 2a. On ebay right now a gent is selling a pair of 10" 2ax speakers that are 10" with a masonite frame for mounting in an 11" hole. I have seen other references, cant remember off the top of my head, where 10" speakers were listed that fit the 10" hole, which makes me think that they also came with an 11" frame.

If I try to install them should I route out the recess to 11" or surface mount the speakers and install new screw mounts. The speakers have already been serviced and had the pots replaced. The tweeters and mids a a-ok. I intend to use 3M Fire Wall putty (for use on cables through fire walls)to seal the speakers. It is tacky and is supposed to stay pliable.

Any ideas/thoughts would be most appreciated.

Speaker serial numbers are 280,352 & 275,685 if that helps.

[tysontom]

The original AR-2/AR-2a/AR-2ax Alnico woofer (up to the 1970 AR-2ax version) had a 6-bolt, 11-inch, cast-aluminum frame. This woofer was called a "10-inch" woofer in the AR literature, and this undoubtedly has greatly confused the current speaker-repair and re-foam businesses today in which the AR-3/AR-3a, flat-side, *12-inch woofer* is invariably called the "11-inch" woofer. After 1970, however, AR went to a stamped-frame, true 10-inch-diameter woofer with four-bolt mounting for the AR-2 series speaker. Subsequently, the AR Customer Services Department supplied a 10-inch, service-replacement woofer with an 11-inch, 6-bolt, masonite ring rivited to the stamped 4-bolt frame for the pre-1970 AR-2-sereies speakers. There were a few 6-bolt, 11-inch stamped frame woofers produced, but these are relatively rare. Also changed in the 1970 AR-2ax was the front baffle board. Earlier AR-2s (as well as the early AR-1s) had a 1-1/8-inch front baffle with the woofer recessed down about 3/4-inches from the top surface. After 1970, the front baffle was changed to the more-conventional, 3/4-inch construction.

If you want to mount the 10-inch woofers with the adapter rings into a newer cabinet with the four-bolt hole (if I correctly understand what you want to do), you can remove the masoninte rings by drilling out the rivets. Then you can mount the speakers in the standard fashion. Use Mortite for gasket material if possible, as it is a known quantity and will stay pliable for many years.

--Tom Tyson

>I have a pair of AR-2ax's that have a pair of 10" Toshiba

>speakers installed. I recently picked up a pair of 10" AR

>speakers for replacements. Low and behold they have the 11"

>frame (AR stamped from April and June of 1968) and the

>speakers cabinets have a recessed cut for the 10" frame....

[draftingmonkey]

I must apologize for not being clear about the speakers I have. They have cloth surrounds and are the type with the 11" metal frame not the masonite adapter ring/frame (which I was using for referencing about 11" speakers for 2ax's). There is no adapter ring to drill out. the frame / basket are all one piece. Hope that makes it clearer.

Thanks

James

[tysontom]

>I must apologize for not being clear about the speakers I

>have. They have cloth surrounds and are the type with the 11"

>metal frame not the masonite adapter ring/frame (which I was

>using for referencing about 11" speakers for 2ax's). There is

>no adapter ring to drill out. the frame / basket are all one

>piece. Hope that makes it clearer.

>

James,

It sounds like you have the 6-bolt 11-inch Alnico woofers, and you want to retrofit them into the newer, 4-bolt 10-inch holes. Is this correct, or am I totally confused? Anyway, you could of course try to rout out the hole and put in new holes and so forth, but that is a lot of work. Your best bet would be to try to locate two of the newer 10-inch, 4-bolt woofers on eBay. They come up from time-to-time. The newer-style, stamped-basket AR-2ax woofer is somewhat better than the original, but the differences are very minor. They both have the same approximate electrical and acoustical parameters, so they are essentially interchangeable. You might run into several variations of that woofer, however, such as the earlier pole-piece magnet, or the later ferrite magnet (usually a square magnet). Try to verify the part number of the 10-inch AR woofers, as there were many variations for other AR speaker models, as well.

Good luck!

--Tom Tyson

[draftingmonkey]

Yes, you are correct that I am trying to mount the 6-hole 11" frame Alinco's into the newer 4-bolt 10" hole. I actually got these on ebay as 10" replacements. At the time I was to uneduacted in the differences between the speakers in early and late model 2ax's, so did not know what questions to ask to ensure I purchesed the correct speaker. Is it possible to surface mount them as the grill sits on a raised ledge above the face of the speaker and the 11" frame fits in nicely. Or, will it ruin the acoustics of the speaker. I really like the AR's as I have 3 pairs of the 4x's which work and sound great and want to make the 2ax's sound good also.

thanks for your help in my quest.

James

[tysontom]

>Yes, you are correct that I am trying to mount the 6-hole 11"

>frame Alinco's into the newer 4-bolt 10" hole. I actually got

>these on ebay as 10" replacements. At the time I was to

>uneduacted in the differences between the speakers in early

>and late model 2ax's, so did not know what questions to ask to

>ensure I purchesed the correct speaker. Is it possible to

>surface mount them as the grill sits on a raised ledge above

>the face of the speaker and the 11" frame fits in nicely. Or,

>will it ruin the acoustics of the speaker. I really like the

>AR's as I have 3 pairs of the 4x's which work and sound great

>and want to make the 2ax's sound good also.

>

>thanks for your help in my quest.

James,

If you can mount the 11-inch Alnico woofer over the top of the 10-inch hole without problem, and the cone surround does not come into contact with the grill, you should be able to mount the woofers the way you wish. You need to be sure that you do not have any air leaks around the frame (some very small air leaks in the cabinet itself are normal) when you mount it, and remember that you will probably be ruining the "originality" of the speaker for selling down the road, but otherwise, you could get it to work satisfactorily I would think. Locating the original replacement woofers might be much harder than I originally estimated, so using what you have might be your only option.

--Tom Tyson

[draftingmonkey]

Tom,

I appreciate your help. I am not to concerned about resale as I intend to keep these speakers for a long time to come. If I take a little time and mount them right I should be able to install original speakers if I can come across them and only have 6 mounting holes to seal.

Thanks for all the advice.

James