dynaco_dan
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Posts posted by dynaco_dan
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Hi there
An exceptional consumer oriented company, not to be seen again.
Thank you for mentioning the shoe polish coverup, it gives us another option.
If I just edited my previous write-up, it would not be picked up by anyone.
The Seas tweeter, as I have written plenty about previously, was the stronger of the two drivers, at least in the A-25 speaker system, about
100 - 1, woofer versus tweeter replacement.
I only ever serviced one A-50 speaker system, I still remember writing down all of the cabinet measurements.
The A-50 required a new tweeter and it would appear to be the weaker link in this dual woofer system.
We will never know which woofer brand, Seas or Scan, ot tweeter brand, Seas or Scan, was ever used in any of the classic Dynaco speaker systems.
It would bug me to find that I had a Scan speaker version in one channel and a Seas speaker version in the other.
I would have said to myself, they must be different.
I guess the tweeter dispersion comments in different old reviews reflected the reviewers opinion and the reflection from the baffle and cabinet edges.
We will never likely find out the full story of Dynaco and how, why and when, the A-25 speaker system.
Why they did not change prefixes when changing the drivers, cabinet layout, mirror images and crossovers mid stream, is anyones guess.
Last visit to ebuy I saw A-10's selling for much more than A-25's.
My guess is that compared only to the A-25's Dynaco sales, their other model sales would be slimmer.
We do not have any hard data about that.
Over a million sold of the A-25's, that is all I've ever read.
Not bad considering that the discounted packaged pair of A-10's were selling new for just over one A-25's list price.
An electrical schematic of the A-10 would be nice along with some crossover photos.
If I wanted center fill, or rear add-on speakers, I would buy A-25's at a generally lower priced, better sounding system, unless space is
also a serious consideration.
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I just "rescued" a pair of walnut Dynaco A-10 from the dormant system of my late father. Other than fading of the walnut finish where
one loudspeaker has been sitting in sunlight for 30+ years (now cured by rubbing in brown shoe polish and buffing!), they're
like they came from the factory. Dynaco and its Danish partners who made those speakers (and the classic A-25s, too) are to be
commended for making something of such high performance and longevity.
The A-10s are about the same size as my main speakers, a pair of Red Rose Rosebuds, a Mark Levinson import with ribbon tweeters.
It will be interesting to compare the two, both with the subwoofers I usually operate with the Rosebuds, and without. Amplification is
all tube, modified/upgraded Dynaco preamp and monoblock power amps.
Hi there
Sorry for the loss of your father.
He had great speaker taste and it was fortunate that you inherited the A-10's.
I am certain that he would be very happy knowing that they will be well looked after by you.
Longevity and durability was a highlight of all Dynaco products.
Only a few classic pieces were ever dropped from their product line, after stereo became the norm and tube equipment sales declined,
otherwise Dynaco sold upgrade kits for most all of their solid state and tube electronic products.
An exceptional consumer oriented company, not to be seen again.
Thank you for mentioning the shoe polish coverup, it gives us another option.
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I have a pair of Dynaco A25 loudspeakers that I use with an old Marantz 2230 receiver . Love the mellow sound this combo produces . It's music to my ears . Recently I passed up a pair of Dynaco A25 XL loudspeakers at the pawn shop . Went back to purchase them and they were sold . Now I'm wondering if I let a great pair of speakers pass me by . Has anyone ever done a listening comparison between the two speakers ? Mine has alnico drivers , the XL I believe has ceramic magnets . Is there a difference between the sound of the alnico speakers and the ceramic versions ? Comments appreciated .
Hi there
First hand comparison, I have heard none, but I do have each type A-25 speakers including the Scans version.
Reading over the years, the A-25XL speakers are more efficient, about 3 db, than the earlier A-25 speaker system.
This will make the XL speakers sound brighter and louder on a simple A - B switching setup, with no volume compensation.
The tweeter is 1" versus the A-25's 1 1/2" unit.
The highend is suppose to be more extended, with possibly slightly better dispersion characteristics.
It has a higher crossover point, I believe, which may affect the midrange sound.
I believe that by the time the XL came out, there was other, and newer competitive speaker products.
Dynaco, un-like AR, in that they did not publicly display their engineering findings, if they did any themselves.
If they did it was minimal.
Dynaco posted reviewers findings and graphs in their literature.
Dynaco was a very consumer oriented company.
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its a wooden speaker cab. Ill have to think about it. Thanks for the help!
IM sort of pissed at ebay with their monopolistic practices. The little embedded fees, etc. The gotcha fees. Small sales arent worth it half the time
Hi there
I was a rescuer of hifi misc a few years ago on ebuy.
I read a sellers comment that, him using paypal, a listing charge and some other charge, it ate up close to 25% of the actual selling bid price.
That was a posted comment in a listing that I was looking at, as a matter of interest.
The elimination of USPS's economy postal service a few years ago, made shipping most everything to here in Vancouver double or more.
I have some very interesting and unique items that I would have liked to have listed and sold on ebuy, except, after reading that comment, I will need to try to sell locally instead.
There is also the buy and sell posting section here as another possible option. MMMMMMM
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I have probably posted more about it than I should have. However, since I did let the cat out of the bag so to speak, I'll review what I did. If you try this, be warned, I found it very time consuming and tedious. On the other hand, the results were more than well worth it. For its type and purpose which I have clearly defined, it's the best setup I've encountered and will beat anything else I have or heard including my modified AR9s (except for AR9's extraordinary deep bass capabilities even with modest amplifier power.)
The problem and solution are based on my own observations and still proprietary mathmatical model of acoustics so I will not tell all but I will give you the general idea which you can try for yourself.
Bose 901 cannot reproduce concert hall acoustics by itself no more than any other current sound system can. There are many reasons for this but the fact that they don't exist on recordings either qualitatively or quantitatively would be sufficient by itself. So the first thing to accept is that you will not be hearing a reasonable facsimile of a live performance at a large public venue from them. The goal of the sound system I devised using them is specific, to reproduce the sound of unamplified musical instruments and human voices as they would be heard in the same room you're in. This restricts their usefulness in this regard to solo instruments and small groups. Although they will of course play any kind of recording, this works best for classical music and jazz. One critical issue is that they will be played at the correct SPL.
Bose 901 has a distinct advantage over all other speaker systems in that it has what I call inherently low absolute vector distortion. This means that sound waves from a single instrument arrive at the listener from a multitude of directions just the way they do from live musical instruments. This is exactly the opposite of the current idea of producing highly directional loudspeaker systems.
Bose 901's main problem as I see it is that it does not produce flat frequency response. The original model and series II are acoustic suspension speakers which have the capability to produce very low tones down to the limits of audibility better than most other speakers. Within their power handling capability, the can give AR9 a run for its money. But power requirements are enormous, far greater than Dr. Bose indicated for most rooms. For this reason they work best in multiple pairs with huge amplifiers. (I use only one pair in a 14 x 14 room with a cathedral ceiling and 138 wpc is marginal. (AR9 does very well with 60 wpc in a room twice as large.) My pair like most I think have a significant peak of around 7 db at around 500 hz. Starting at this point and going down in frequency the speaker falls off at 12db per octave like any AS speaker system but the equalizer only supplies 6db per octave boost. So a cut is needed at 500hz and slightly above and then rising output as frequency lowers by another 6db per octave. If you have series III or later, you may not hear the lowest octave and might overload the system if you try. From what I can tell, the ported system is likely cut off at an octave above the AS version. This additional equalization can bring the bass into far flatter and more extended performance without playing it at deafening levels.
901's other problem for any version is that a 4" driver we call a midwoofer today makes for an awful tweeter. Not only is output of the highest octave very limited due to the high inertial mass of the cone (Gordon Holt's observation with which I fully agree) but what little output it produces in this range beams directly on axis. This is a consequence of the cone diameter. To correct this problem, I used an array of small mylar tweeters similar to Audax's 3/8" version. They are very inexpensive and easy to obtain. I used 8 ohm versions. I used 6 per channel, three on the back facing left, right and center, two facing the ceiling, and one in front directly above the 4" driver. I crossed them over at 6db per octave at around 9khz and drive them with a separate amplifier. Equalization for each recoring is critical to obtain correct tonality. I'd say only about 5% of the tweeter energy is directed forward owing to the crossover design and the reflected energy does not have the same FR as the direct energy. This is done to compensate for the differential absorption of the sound as a function of frequency before it reaches the listener. The goal is to have not only the direct sound flat but all of the reflections too. This eliminates two additional forms of geometric distortion my model predicts that other speaker systms can't come close to preventing unless you are unfortunate to be in the world's worst possible listening space, an anechoic chamber.
When properly adjusted, the ability of this configuration to accurately reproduce the sound of musical instruments and voices with remarkable presence from recordings is astonishing, far better than I would have expected. The success of this arrangement is proof that the theory that Redbook CD from inexpensive CD players is adequate for any music is compelling, it's all you need. No exotic audiophile amplifiers, wires, or other peculiar devices that are popular but carry no weight with mainstream electrical engineers are necessary either and would serve no useful purpose. In fact they would probably detract from this system if they have any effect at all. For best results, each recording will need its own equalization owing to the variables of spectral balance inherent in recordings. Multiple equalizers are desirable to facillitate this, my setup for this system has four inclding the Bose equalizer. Fortunately they are not expensive.
BTW, my first effort at this in the early 1990s was a complete failure and my second effort even when I had much more experience re-engineering other speakers and knew what had to be done took nearly four years from 2004 to 2008 before I considered it entirely successful.
Hi there
You have written an interesting commentary of your quest and accomplishments, very well done, Soundminded.
Did using add-ons such as, the Microstatic tweeter arrays, of course with the original Peerless tweeter drivers, or Janszen 1-30 or equal speaker arrays
cross your mind in your investigation?
For a secretive man you write very openly, in my opinion, thank you very much.
I have never owned a pair or even auditioned a pair in my home.
On very rare occasion I did hear them demo'd in a few stereo stores, very spacious sounding indeed, when used with their speaker stands of course.
In my work in thousands of homes I only ever saw one pair of Bose 901's, at each end of a chesterfield, sitting on
the floor, used as end tables.
Once in a local pub, I saw a pair suspended from their ceiling, they were sufficiently far enough from the wall, which was good, but they were v'd toward the
open room.
I mentioned to them that they should be v'd towards the wall, and why, I never returned there to see if they reversed them.
It has been over 35 years since I last heard a pair.
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I could not figure out from your posts if you have the Dynaco A-10 or just interested. I have a very nice pr of A-25 I use for the TV room thinking I'd like to get an A-10 for a center channel to voice match my current right and left. How do the A-10's sound? I have been searching for a set or single, but haven't found one yet.
I have a pdf of the 1975 catalog that says they voiced it as close to the A-25 as possible used the same tweeter same aperiodic enclosure.
David
Hi David
When I first wrote here on this site about my, classic Dynaco A-10, all I owned then was a single
speaker, less the woofer.
It had been given to me free from a past customer of mine.
It has a vinyl covered cabinet with a dark brown grille cloth.
Time passed by and I got the ebuy bug, badly.
I was rescuing everything I could and finally bought a mint pair of complete A-10's in an
oiled walnut cabinet, with the original beige linen grille cloth's, from a fellow Canadian seller.
They look like they just came out of the factory, they were very well looked after and also well
packaged for shipping to me.
Being as he was a Canadian seller, there was really no bidding competition for me, it seems like bidders stay away
from Canada, probably thinking that our customs is such a hassle to deal with.
It is.
The tweeter used is the 1 1/2 inch Seas model, was the same 8 ohm unit also used in the classic A-25, A-35 and A-50 speakers.
The later XL 1 inch tweeters were slightly more efficient and so they are a little louder sounding when compared.
The A-50 used 2 - 15 ohm woofers, paralleling them is an 8 ohm load, all other classic speakers used, were 8 ohm woofers.
There may have been a Scan tweeter used in early production A-10 units, I do not know that for a fact.
The A-25 and A-50 used some Scan tweeters and woofers in early production units, amount unknown.
The speaker model number, the first two numbers on the rear label, did not change, whether using the Seas or Scan model drivers.
The A-10 woofer uses the same magnet assembly as the 1 1/2 inch tweeter, as did most, but not all of the 10 inch woofers.
I will be taking pictures of these and starting another topic in the near future with photos galore, showing these differences.
The A-10 cabinet was also vented externally, Aperiodic, similar to the A-25.
There is no level control or banana plug connections, just screw terminals.
All Dynaco classic speakers were all approximately of the same sound quality, except mostly in the lower, under 100 hz range.
The fuse for it, as well as some of the others, was 1 amp fast blow and for the A-50 a 1 1/2 amp fast blow fuse, slow blow fuses were never mentioned.
There hasn't been any information, that I am aware of, regarding using a Bussmann or Littlefuse FNM/FLM slow blow fuse, as Advent and AR had recommended
for their speaker owners, also there was no fast blow fuses even mentioned by them.
Smooth impedance curves means that any of these 4 models could be used without as much concern about adding
difficult amplifier loading, as with typical speakers.
The A-10 had the least bass output of the 4 clasic speakers, the tweeter across the board, was by far the stronger of the two drivers.
You may be interested in using a Dynaco Quadaptor and a pair of A-10's.
Another pair of A-25's will likely cost you less and offer you more satisfying sound.
Do a search here for, "Dynamax", a wiring diagram for various multi Dynaco speakers.
At this time it is actually just 2 topics below this one, it was originally started by, "dynacophil".
Just a thought for tonight.
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i just picked up a dynaco 120 amp and a dynaco pat-4 preamp. i've never had any dynaco stuff before these are neat little units. anything i should be aware of on these?. these are factory built units and not the kits. what is the easiest way to clean the chrome on the amp. thanks.
Hi there
The one issue that I am aware of is, the, "ST-120 TIP mod".
The earliest units and onward, were updated with newer transistors, etc.
The TIP mod is a list of the various parts and in some cases a drawing is included.
Search the net for, "ST-120 TIP MOD".
Normally, I would say, if it's not broken, don't fix it.
If you or any owner of the ST-120 amp decides not to modify their amp, fuse your speakers.
After reading about some amp's taking out speakers when the amp goes bad, fusing is a good idea.
My friend, Tony, was the western Canadian Dynaco, AR, etc, etc, service rep back in the '60's and '70's.
This is who I volunteered to, helpng him service AR, Dynaco, etc, etc, back in the early '70's.
He would say do the mod irregardless if you are having problems or not.
He also suggested to me to really scrutinize the wiring solder connections, particularily the board connections, even for factory wired units.
Particularly look for poor or cold solder joints.
That is all I can think of at the moment.
The Audio Amatuer magazine had numerous, actually, hundreds of mods for various electronic Dynaco products.
I computerized a list of mods by brandname back in the mid '90's, of AR, Dynaco, Crown and anything else that I had an interest in.
The list was way over 1,500+ listings, a lot of one fingered typing, some were ads or just references to, not necessarily mods.
I noted real briefly what the listing was for and I had lot's of time on my hands then.
I was a long time subscriber of TAA and I quite enjoyed reading them over the many decades that I subscribed to it.
I sent an email to, Mr Edward Dell, the owner and publisher, a few years ago asking if I could quote from some back issues and possibly
share pictures from them to this site, not for profit.
I did not ask to pay for them, but I did say I would credit TAA when quoted.
Never received a response from him.
I cannot with good conscience post any of The Audio Amatuer, Speaker Builder or Glass Audio artcles, without his permission.
You have the stereo pair that I highly recommended to my friends back in those day's.
Enjoy
Vern
dynaco_dan2@yahoo.ca
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Hi there
Better late than never LOL
Because of severe hearing loss I would not be a good juge of sound to do a comment even, sorry.
Hi again
I will do an A -B sound test even though my hearing is off a little.
Vern
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I spoke to Roy C. who spends more time here on the AR forum and commented about how excellent his AR-2ax's looked:
http://www.classicspeakerpages.net/dc/dcbo...pe=search#11164
That material, in his first picture, is 18 ct, and it has the most open weave that I've seen so far. The texture is more of an expensive linen and it looks very close to the original Dyna A-25 material. Roy offered his source as:
http://www.123stitch.com/cgi-bin/fabric.pl
It is under linen, 18 ct, "Lambswool" color.
I estimated the count for the Dyna A-25s as closer to 28 but this was based on pictures and memory. I completed these grilles using "Zweigart 100% Linen, 28 Count, Cashel Raw Linen" purchased at a Michael's store. The color is a bit darker than what I remember and I believe that the 18 CT linen mentioned above is a better match.
Moderators can you pin this thread since it is such a common
question?
Hi Pete
I saw a close copy of the clothe used by Dynaco and I stared at for about 5 years now.
It is my daughters living room curtains, not the shears that hangs between the blinds and the window.
I haven't done a side by side comparison just from memory.
The shears are a nice colour also.
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I spoke to Roy C. who spends more time here on the AR forum and commented about how excellent his AR-2ax's looked:
http://www.classicspeakerpages.net/dc/dcbo...pe=search#11164
That material, in his first picture, is 18 ct, and it has the most open weave that I've seen so far. The texture is more of an expensive linen and it looks very close to the original Dyna A-25 material. Roy offered his source as:
http://www.123stitch.com/cgi-bin/fabric.pl
It is under linen, 18 ct, "Lambswool" color.
I estimated the count for the Dyna A-25s as closer to 28 but this was based on pictures and memory. I completed these grilles using "Zweigart 100% Linen, 28 Count, Cashel Raw Linen" purchased at a Michael's store. The color is a bit darker than what I remember and I believe that the 18 CT linen mentioned above is a better match.
Moderators can you pin this thread since it is such a common
question?
Hi Pete
I saw a close copy of the clothe used by Dynaco and I stared at for about 5 years now.
It is my daughters living room curtains, not the shears that hangs between the blinds and the window.
I haven't done a side by side comparison just from memory.
The shears are a nice colour also and maybe suitable as a plainer grille cloth.
My point is, perhaps looking at stores that sell or make curtains would be a great source.
I've looked in a few fabric stores a few years ago and bought some Advent similar material.
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Hi Craig;
The comparison hasn't happened yet.
My home was terribly disrupted by a leaking roof and I haven't recovered yet.
Hi there
Better late than never LOL
Because of severe hearing loss I would not be a good juge of sound to do a comment even, sorry.
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I had some reproduction labels made. They're aluminum, and pretty good copies. Shown here. I can also get the larger KLH, but they will also be stick-on aluminum--not cast. Waiting for the KLH logos for the Model Eight and Eleven-W.
$5 each. Questions? email KLHbyJKH@gmail.com
Kent
Hi Kent
Nice looking copies, Kent.
Vern
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permatex is avail from carquest auto parts in canada/usa,
www.carquest.com,
Hi there;
I may have mentioned this earlier but it bears repeating.
In Vancouver the cans I bought of the 3M and Permatex products are specially handled and labeled.
They are treated as explosives or similar.
They cannot go through the regular mailing process but require special trucking transportion.
The seller on eBay may have broken US Federal Postal laws, etc, in mailing the product to a member.
In Canada we pay a special trucking surcharge under the Dangerous Goods Act, pennies on the dollar but a surcharge nevertheless.
You will need to buy it locally and pick it up in person or not at all.
Vern
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Did dynaco produce a type a-100? And if so, what did it look like??
Hi Fred;
I personally do not know of a Dynaco Model 100 Dynaco speaker system.
There may have been one made.
There has been several models pop up on this site as new members come on board.
Some models were available in Europe and a later series was made in Canada.
The Canadian versions were not that successful as were the later versions made in the USA.
The A-10, A-25, A-35 and A-50 were the more well known models, with the A-25 leading the pack in volume sales.
There was the later XL versions but the original classics were the more popular.
Vern
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Rob's KLH Model Twelve Crossover Rebuild
All new mylar film caps, except the 50uF value (no room!), which is made up of a 10uF mylar and a 40uF NPE. The 16uF value is made up of 10 + 5 + 1, and the 4uFs are 3 + 1. Those are the values we had to work with. Originally we had "bundles" for the 50uF value, consisting of 33uF NPE, 10uF mylar, 7uF mylar. Too big-- the nice external xover cabinets have limited headroom.
btw--I gave the wrong parts list in an earlier post (those dual value caps threw me off)
The correct caps for each crossover are:2) 50uF
1) 16uF
3) 4uF
1) 3uF
Hi Kent;
Great job you did again.
Thanks for the update on the cap values as well.
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Hi Vern, I guess I was being sarcastic because of my own frustration at times about the lack of info. but you opened my eyes to the fact that I/we are dealing with the 1968 information level in 2008, information flows at such an enormus rate now and companies like to boast about their products and how they come to be, this forum would probably have many more members if KLH R&D was a current company with many more eyes watching it , there are just a few of us here dealing with 40+ year old products. The M12 TEST stamping is on the back of the magnet on the mids and tweeters right next to the date, I only mentioned it because it's the first time I've ever seen that on any model, Take care, Rob
Hi Rob;
I never worked for a speaker manufacturer, I do not know exactly what they do when they re-design or discontinue a product.
They may have just torn up the old drawings and started over again.
Here, locally, when Heathkit shut down, all onhand manuals, for just one example, were dumpstered.
A former employee salvaged all that were available and is still hoarding them.
All Heathkit branches and the factory may have done the same thing or not.
Anyways, historical documents were destroyed.
Too bad this type information was not sent to a museum of sorts.
Due to a communication problem, my big bros set outside his house a carton of accummulated hifi data, including AR-LST, AR-10 pi and AR-3A improved blueprints, just for me.
I did not find them and all the data went to the dump, forever.
KLHMark brought the KLH pair of driver sheets to the table last year, thank you, Mark.
As a side note, try finding a factory original introduction sheet to the KLH Twelve.
So far no factory documents have surfaced, but may still do so in the future.
Try finding an original Heathkit original AS-2 owners manual.
I'm working on this one.
Photo copies are being sold on ebay but the originals are as scarce as hen's teeth.
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Vern, Trying to do a history on the original KLH you'd think you were doing a study on a company in eastern Russia in 1900, I wanted to add that when I bought those Model 12 woofers the guy did produce the Model 6 woofer for comparison, same basket ,same cone, same surround, different magnet and likely different voice coil. When we had the 12's apart last fall I remember the stampings that showed 1968 and 1969, I don't remember the dates, also on the 12's I bought as a pair there were stampings on all of the mids and tweeters that said M-12 TEST. I wonder if we'll ever know anymore about the 2 tweeters KLH mentioned in their brochures, the 1 5/8 inch and the 1 3/4 inch, maybe it's my eyes but I 've never been able to see the size difference in the cones, Thanks for the reply Vern, Kent will be receiving all of my crossover boxes today, Rob
Hi Rob;
Your first sentence pretty well sums up most classic manufacturers as well as KLH, Rob.
At first I thought it was a sarcastic comment but I will accept it as not being sarcastic.
You are incorrect about all of the woofers, though.
They all look alike YES, are physically alike, NO.
They used different weight cones between the various models.
The Sixes used 18 - 20 gram cones.
The Seveteen, Twenty and Thirty-Three another un-listed weight as of now.
The M-12 test and 23 - 25 gram cone markings, usually marked on the cone front, sometimes marked on the rear of the cone, are pretty certain to be just for the KLH Twelve.
They probably were interchangeable downward for the KLH Fives, Twenty-Threes and possibly others as well, in a pinch.
Perhaps more information will be forthcoming in the future from a newer member.
There was at least 4 or more different magnet systems as well.
The voice coil size differences, I am not aware of, no data, yet.
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Hi Vern, I can still relay these numbers to Kent but since you wanted them I'll post here, As mentioned before I have 4 Model 12's, The ones I bought as a pair are 003708 and 003711, of the other two only one has the sticker and it is 00475, I looked again to make sure of that and that one only has 5 digits instead of 6 , Also I have the back plates that came from a pair that the cab's were real bad and the woofers were missing so the guy just sold me the rest including boxes for $100 and those numbers are 004422 and 004426. I have been reading around and I see people saying that they have seen Model 12's with square magnet woofers that were original, I have never seen that myself only the double ring round magnets, in fact in 1975 I was in Cleveland Ohio visiting and I went to the local KLH repair facility to buy some Model 5 woofers for a homebuilt system and the guy at the counter said " why not buy the 12 woofers for $48, $8.00 more than the 5 woofer and the 12 woofer had a double ring round magnet, (6 woofer was $32), I bought a pair and put them in my Model 23's and they rocked the house for many years powered by my Dynaco SCA80-Q I built in 1973, the 23 woofers went to the project, I am amazed how few KLH Research and Development employees are around to comment on any of these posts/subjects, I do indeed wish they would speak up more and give us more knowledge of the operations in the original KLH R&D, Rob
Hi Bob;
Thanks for posting the serial numbers.
Other than the former serviceman from KLH, we have mainly Andy and Kent who contributes to the KLH data.
It appears now that at least 5,000 KLH Twelves were made, assuming that they used consecutive serial numbers.
If Kent can confirm that these same numbers are also inside your crossover cases written in pencil we can start some sort of historical data.
I am assuming that they serial numbered the crossovers to match their speaker enclosure.
The former employee mentioned that the woofers were modified after they were found to bottom out and a bump was stamped on the back of the magnet for these later units.
The KLH Fives, Twenty-Three's, and Twelves used the same woofers, usually marked 23 - 25 gram's on the cones.
Perhaps over time, when a driver is removed from any of the enclosures, dates can then be posted as well.
I am assuming that they clearly rubber stamped the dates on all their drivers.
It will be a long slow process.
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Hello to all, I've been reading the posts on the model twelves, I know it has been a while since anyone was here but I'm finally out of the hospital to ask any/all of you if anyone can help me. I lost my hands and was severly burned in a work accident in 1997, I haven't lost my love of music or the old school stereo equipment and the great quality sound they still have, my problem/blessing is that I now have 4 KLH Model 12 speakers and 6 crossover boxes, I live in Colorado Springs and I just left the local high end stereo shop where the guy couldn't fix my Marantz 150 tuner so I took the boxes and the new caps to him and he told me it was all " hard wiring and labor intensive " in other words he is too lazy to deal with it unless its a pcb replacement, my question I'm putting out is....can anyone help me re-cap these or does anyone know someone who would be willing to help me out, my sons are in California and Oregon and they helped me get all the drivers squared away but they can't break free again til late summer to help with these crossovers, I'm very willing to pay for the time spent working on them, I will be watching to see if anyone responds, Thanks, Robert
Hi Robert;
Sorry about your accident.
Kent has previosly posted his before and after cap mods to his own KLH Twelve Contour Control boxes.
Quality workmanship can be seen in his work.
Thank goodness no one needs to haul all 4 speaker enclosures around, Heh?
Kent, on the inner mounting plywood board, at the top at about 1:00 o'clock is a penciled serial number, 3 or 4 digits, please, Kent, list if doing the mods, please.
Also Robert, please provide Kent with the speaker enclosure serial numbers off the rear of the enclosures.
This is just to determine the number of KLH Twelves manufactured and possibly even a date from the caps or resistors or drivers.
There is virtually no information about production numbers or mods from most manufacturers.
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Hi again;
The tweeter used in the KLH Twelve and other KLH models was always well received in reviews, as I remember.
Maybe not perfect, it is a dynamic tweeter and not an electrostatic tweeter.
Certainly speaks well of it's solid design and range, when it is used in more than one model KLH speaker.
The model 12.5 mids, were full-range when used on their own, or as midrange drivers in tandem, as used in the KLH Fives and Twelves, which required separate sealed sub-enclosures for them.
Pretty amazing feat for such a small driver with only a cloth surround.
The same woofers, also only with cloth surrounds, were used in the KLH Twenty-Three's, Five's, and Twelve's, attesting to their robust construction, as well.
With KLH doing their in-house driver manufacturing, their quality control was very tight and positive.
With the floor standing cabinet's each being 29" high x 22" wide x 15" deep and not too much under 100 pounds each, it was fighting the WAF.
Being a floor standing speaker and twice the size of the AR-3A's, it does appear that an instore display would have, in most cases, be against the size of the KLH Twelves, against the smaller and shelf friendlier AR-3A's, nevermind sound comparisons.
Yes, it would be nice to have a battle of the speakers, so to speak.
An AR-3a vs KLH Twelve and AR-5 vs KLH Five friendly battle, would make for an interesting and entertaining comparison.
Yes, the KLH Twelves can be wall mounted, with special re-inforcements.
They can also be stacked.
Hi there;
Does anyone have a copy of the KLH Twelve owners manual/brochure?
Does anyone have a approximate number manufactured?
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Here's a loaner version of the BSC that I just built. Top and bottom
(for right and left) switches are 3 position BSC boost switches for 4, 5,
or 6 dB. Center switch allows for Flat or Boost on the high end. Boost
is more for the original Advent and Flat for new, however many listeners
will probably prefer Boost.
Here's a picture: http://baselaudiolabs.googlepages.com/BSC_SW_CR.JPG
Hi Pete;
You did a very neat construction job of it.
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Corrected drawing of Mr. Roy Allison.
Minh Luong
Hi Minh;
Thank you for the update.
A very nice touch including Roy's photo as well.
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There are serious mistakes being made on these Cello Amati speakers! Should you ever need Cello/AR drivers to convert them back to their original condition, just drop me an email and I should be able to bring them back to their original shapes and sound quality.
Minh Luong
mluong303@aol.com
Hi Minh;
What are the Allison tweeters doing in the speaker cabinet?
Are those Allison midrange drivers as well?
Vern
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I just located this letter from Mr. Roy Allison to me in December 2000 and would like to share his answers to everyone who love his speakers.
My questions to Mr. Allison were:
Minh Luong
Hi Minh;
Thank you very much for posting this information.
Vern
The correct caps for each crossover are:
Roy Allison AR-3a AR-LST & Mark Levinson Cello Amati speakers
in Acoustic Research
Posted
Hi Minh
I was very happy to read all of this tonight.
Very gracious of Roy Allison to even remember and be willing to share all this so many years after leaving AR.
He was MR AR when he was there for sure.
I believe because of his excellent communication with me that I fell in love with all AR products.