What do you listen to, to test speakers

[Guest OldRelayer]

In the old days when I lived closer to Boston and there was an abundance of stereo stores, I would spend some time checking out the new equipment. Now a days I live in Central Maine, and I suspect that even if you live close to a populated area a true stereo store may be a thing of the past.

Well anyway, it was always interesting what the salesman would play for you. I remember one playing Pink Floyd "Dark Side of the Moon" "Pulse" to point out how great the bass from a strange looking Ohm speaker was. I did try that with my 3a's and it seems like it equals or surpasses the OHM, also the last movement of Mahler's 2nd Symphony has some serious bass. Another guy put on "Its a beautiful day" "White Bird" not sure what he was trying to say with it, but it sounded good and I went out and bought the album, it is a collectable and worth about $25, thanks guy. I like classical, Jazz and Progressive Rock. A true test for me is Yes "Close to the Edge", lesser speakers and equipment will really make this great piece of music sound like crap.

So I thought it would be a fun thread if people chimed in and talked a little about how they listen to new equipment.

Thanks

Barry

[Guest David in MA]

I don't know about testing the speakers but have you listen to the weather report's birdland? Any steely dan sounds great also.

[Guest OldRelayer]

I do have a couple weather report, but not birdland. Actually I have every Steely Dan and just bought but haven't received yet the new "Everything must Go" on Vinyl. Anxious to see how something produced for digital sounds on Vinyl, of course it sounds good on CD, but then again everything Steely Dan does sounds good.

[Carlspeak]

Barry.

I've made my own test disk from a varitey of music. It starts with 1/3 octave warble tones that go from 16 Hz to 20 kHz. Following that is a variety of music ranging from classical, rock, female and male singers, etc. The one I ususally start with is a cut from a Kenny Rankin CD. The song is "you'd be so nice to come home to". There's lots of base, his voice, sizzle of cymbals and piano. It's kind of Jazzy and pretty well runs the gamut of the frequency range. It's also very well recorded. The complete, detailed list of my test tunes was published by Speaker Builder magazine in their last issue in 2000. They ran a variety of lists different people offered over a series of issues.

Sometimes, speaker reviewers in Stereophile Magazine list tunes they've used to evaluate speakers. I've gotten some good ideas from those articles as well.

Remember, it's all about the music

Carl

Carl's Custom Loudspeakers

[Guest David in MA]

>I do have a couple weather report, but not birdland.

Birdland is a song on an album titled "heavy report" (I think). Great tune to hear a wide range of tone.

>Anxious to see how something produced for digital sounds on

>Vinyl, of course it sounds good on CD, but then again

>everything Steely Dan does sounds good.

>

It really is amazing the job that steely dan did on their albums. I don't have all of them - only 6. The ones I have, they are amazing albums. My favorites? Countdown to ecstasy. Something about "hey nineteen"...it's a great tune...

[Guest OldRelayer]

>I don't know about testing the speakers but have you listen

>to the weather report's birdland? Any steely dan sounds great

>also.

David send me your email to bbm1@verizon.net, there is something I want to send you and I would rather not use the forum.

[Guest OldRelayer]

Oh, I don't forget its about the music, I usually just play what I like and if it passes that test, it is a good speaker for me. I was more curious as to what people of the forum liten to and it was a speaker related way of asking, sorta keeps it on Topic.

[soundminded]

"This has been a test. This was only a test. Had this been actual music, you would have been directed to turn off all electronic equipment and sit quietly."

I think the terms "objectivist" and "subjectivist" to categorize the way we select audio equipment is far less useful than "absolutist" and "relativist." There is no denying that at the current state of the art, we cannot make any intelligent choices about what to buy on lab measuements alone but the matter of personal preference can also lead to choices which we later come to regret. I think at different times and different circumstances, we can be more of one and less of the other. When we buy a home theater sound system for a family room, personal preference for sound and duplicating the movie going experience is most important even though by traditional terms, accuracy has little or no meaning. But when buying equipment for serious music listening, I have never wavered in the old notion that audio equipment's job is to produce sound as close as possible to that of live unamplified musical instruments. Therefore with audio memory notoriously short, the best way to condition your ears and brain before selecting speakers is to listen to lots of live music first and to avoid listening to other sound systems, especially your own. If what we heard last becomes a kind of reference to compare equipment to, then using the memory of one colored sound system to avoid buying another makes little sense to me.

I try to pick recordings which present the widest possible range of different kinds of musical sounds both singly and in combinations and recorded in a way as to "document" their performance rather than to "editorialize" them. CDs are the most convenient way to drag recordings to a store or someone else's home and represent for me the state of the art of recording media for consumers. They also reduce or eliminate altogether the variable of phonograph cartridge performance which is far more audible than differences in cd players. I'll bring symphonies, concertos, solo performances, choirs, organ music, jazz combos, and try to hear as many of them as possible. They are recordings I am very familiar with so I know what I usually expect to hear. I try to listen to each insturment or group of instruments individually. For instance, in listening to the recent setup of a very expensive sound system, I noticed that cellos in a recording of Pictures at an Exhibition were almost inaudible and the lower octaves of pianos were very weak while solo violin was highly colored even though the speakers had a very clear sound. I avoid all music which used electronic intruments such as electric guitars or where instruments or voices were obviously "processed" such as pop or rock music. While these may be entertaining at home, I don't see how they can be useful to me for selecting "accurate" equipment since there was no live musical performance basis for the signal on the recording.

Some music which offers many varieties and combinations of sounds on a single recording are;

Pictures at an Exhibition

Scherezade

Rhapsody in Blue

Britten's Young People's guide to the Orchestra

Carnival of the Animals

Fanfare for the Common Man (good test of bass drums)

I also like to take a recording or two of a Dixieland jazz band. The best I have are on Green Hill Records.

I also will pick vocals by Luciano Pavorotti, Kiri Tekenawa, and The Mormon Tabernacle Choir.

[Guest OldRelayer]

It is true that pure acoustic instruments offer a challenge for most speakers. I recently took home a pair of $800 Klipsh speakers, Klipsh has a good name and I had just blown out a pair of speakers, another story. Some things sounded pretty good but an album I really like is "ESP” by Patrick Moraz, it is very nice grand Piano, on the Klipsh it sounded at best like a toy piano, really awful and no adjustment seemed to help very much. On the other hand Pink Floyd’s Dark side of the Moon sounded good and some parts even great, of course this is mostly electric. The same speakers had a terrible time separating the instruments in some Yes that I enjoy. They are ported and the bass just didn't sound right, I don't know what was going on technically, what I do know is I didn't like it. These were very heavy towers that I didn’t really want to box up and bring back, but I did. On the other hand all the above and everything else I have tried on my AR-3a’s all sound terrific.

Mahler’s 2nd Symphony is a 2 CD set, back in 1989 I paid way to much for it, $30, but it has the fullest range of sounds. Some people may not even think it is that musical, but it really tests a stereo system. Not quite right and the female voices can sound quite shrill, the horns quite brassy and the bass in incredibly demanding and can sound petty awful if not done properly. If I really want to zero in on the mid-range, Gary Burton/ Ralph Towner’s “Slide show" on Vinyl will show up any i mperfection in this area. I once had a 12 string Guild just like Towners, so it is one of the instruments I do think I know what it should sound like. I do still play some classical guitar and the Klipsh made Segovia’s guitar sound like a yukalalie (this didn’t pass my spell checker, but I think it is right).

I am wondering, if a sweep generator isn’t a quick way of weeding out speakers that just don’t even have a clue. If you were buying speakers at a yard sale, you could spot a driver not working pretty quickly. I guess I would carry around a sweep generator, but you could either find a recording or make one.

As usual, I know just enough to be dangerous.

Barry

[Carlspeak]

Another quick test I forgot to mention in my earlier post is listening to a pink noise track. All the humanly audible frequencies are played simultaneously at constant energy level. Pink noise tracks can be found on most CD's with test tracks.

Remember, it's all about the music

Carl

Carl's Custom Loudspeakers

[dynaco_dan]

Hi Carl;

Would you please list your favourite test records and cd's if you would please.

Thank you.

[Guest postjob62]

Well, someone always has to take the low road I suppose, so in contrast to those of you with more refined tastes I'll expose my soft underbelly. Here goes:

These first two are acoustic, although I suspect the first one is probably amplified acoustic. I've mentioned it here before, I think.

1. "Endangered Species" by Lynyrd Skynryd form 1994. You'd just have to hear it to believe it, especially through well-amplified 3a's. It's not what the stereotype would lead you to believe; you have my assurance that after listening one night you won't wake up the next morning to mysteriously find a stars-and bars decal on your pickup. If there's a flaw in your 3a's, this one will expose it.

2. "Jerry Garcia/David Grisman", self-titled from 1991. Some of the most beautiful acoustic guitar/mandolin work you'll ever hear in this genre. When you can hear calloused fingers sliding over wound strings, and hear mis-frets very clearly, you know you're there.

3. In the electric category, one of our gurus in the forum here (Roy C. to be exact) put me onto this one: Mark Knopfler's new CD entitled "Shangri-La". Wow, it takes the dynamic range of it's medium pretty much to the limits, and nice music to boot.

There you have it-an alternative approach I suppose. If anyone has heard of or tries any of these I'd love to hear about it.

Ed

[Carlspeak]

>Hi Carl;

>

>Would you please list your favourite test records and cd's if

>you would please.

>

>Thank you.

On my home made test disk I have 14 cuts.

1) 1/3 octave warble tones from Pierre Verany test disk. I use these to test speaker performance over the entire audio spectrum.

2)Tritico - track 2 Adagio Fredrick Fennell conducting

3) Tritico - track 4 Feast day in Seville - it's long but excellently recorded. Same conductor and orchestra.

4) Sting "A thousand Years" from Brand new Day. Mucho bass to rattle the windows at the beginning. If you can't hear it your speakers don't go low enough!

5)Lyle Lovette, "North Dakota" from Joshua Judges Ruth. This was the first recording of Lyle I got and fell in love with his music. Also an excellent recording.

6) Jennifer Warnes, "First We Take Manhattan". This is a classic audiophile favorite. It was recorded a bit edgy. If your cat runs for the back door and your dog howles when you play it, your mids and tweeters need work.

7) Holly Cole, "Take me Home" from Temptation. Another excellently recorded acoustic audiophile disk. If you get up close and right between your speakers you'll swear she's standing right in front of you (only if your speakers image well and the soundstage is very good)

8) Dean Peer, "Lords Tundra" from Ucross. Dean plays solo virtuoso electronic bass - lots of dynamics and harmonics. I heard this tune played over a $150,000 stereo system during a demonstration at the now closed Madrigal Audio Laboratories in Middletown, CT. Amazing!

9) Fairfield Four, "How I got Over", from Standing in the Safety Zone. This was a record of the month chosen by Stereophile magazine.

Great male accapella from a vintage group of gospel singers. Well imaged stereo system will have the 5 of them standing right in front of you.

10) ZZ Top, "Pincushion" From Antenna. This is one of my favorite rock tunes. It contains a pretty demanding drum backdrop to their great guitar work.

11)Kenny Rankin, "You'd be so nice to come home to", from Professional Dreamer album. This is my favorite test track. Buy it, listen to it and you'll see why.

12) Cardon & Bestor, "Sage of Lamberene" Innovators CD. This is a sampler only. I don't think it's available commercially. Tons of ambience.

13) Dag Jensen, Mozart's concerto for Bassoon. I love the throaty, deep tones of the bassoon. They are displayed here quite nicely.

14) Another Dag Jensen cut from the same CD as 13).

A couple more recently discovered Gems:

Mysterium - Cut No. 1. This is sacred aria sung by soprano Angela Gheorghiv recorded in All Hallows Church with a backup chorus and orchestra. Fantastic ambiance.

Bassic Instincts - Cut No. 2 from their recording of Mussorgsky's Pictures at an Exhibition. This is played by a cello and bass enxemble comprised of 10 musicians. I love the deep growl of the lower registers of both instruments. Lots of dynamics going on here in this short piece. All selections are obviously transcribed for this unique group.

Alas, these are my favorites. There are more, but I've done enough typing here. In any case, everyone will have their own favorites which could vary greatly from my list and that's okay.

Remember, it's all about the music

Carl

Carl's Custom Loudspeakers

[Guest flammaster]

The big test for me in a good loudspeaker is can it handle Drum And Bugle Corps?

Especially Blue Devils, Cadets or Vanguard.

I like to try Sheherezahd and Trittico. I also try as a big test Brain Salad Surgery and some Zappa as the real test for audio excellence.

Then I'll put on some Roy Buchanan or Danny Gatton to see if it passes the screaming Telecaster test.

[Guest nathanso]

Mark Knopfler's new CD entitled "Shangri-La" is my test CD. 5:15 AM, the first track, in particular.

Chuck Ainlay (http://chuckainlay.com/flash_index.php) was the sound engineer and the quality of the recording is phenomenal. MK is my favorite artist and I've heard all his albums countless times, but it occurred to me recently that I listen as much for the music as I do for the sound, if that makes any sense.

[Steve F]

I have used the same ten or 15 discs for the past decade or better. These are recordings with which I’m extremely familiar, and they provide a very dependable, repeatable basis for evaluation from speaker to speaker. It’s interesting that the same Fairfield Four and Lyle Lovett discs that Carl uses are on my list as well.

My collection of test materials are not necessarily the very best recordings available (although some are quite good), but rather, they’re discs that I know inside and out. If I know disc A to be a little bright, but it sounds super smooth when listening to new speaker X, then that tells me something worthwhile.

Also, for obvious reasons, I tend not to use my favorite music when evaluating speakers, since with great, emotionally-moving music, one’s opinion of the speaker can easily be swayed.

Here’s a gem that’s not likely to be heard very often: an album named Pastiche by jazz vocalist Vanessa Rubin, a 1993 Novus recording. Track 6 is a rendition of the standard “I Only Have Eyes For You,” done as a vocal-acoustic bass duet. If a speaker has any tendency towards mid-bass bloat or coloration, this recording will reveal it in ruthless, unapologetic fashion.

Steve F.

[dynaco_dan]

Hi Carl;

Thank you very much for listing these favourites of yours.