volvo245ls
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Posts posted by volvo245ls
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Michpat!
Pics are coming, good buddy:)!!
Then you'll see more additions, too. Including things Marantz (I looked at your profile).
I replaced my Marantz SR7200 with a much newer SR 6005. Added some beef power with an MM9000 5-channel THX Ultra power amp that has the biggest Torroidal transformer I've ever seen. The MM9000 weighs 45 pounds by itself.
Also started collecting Acoustic Research Master series interconnects and 10 & 12 awg speaker wire.
So far the results are very exciting.
Sound is much more well-balanced due to the Audessey Multi-EQ set-up capability and the extra current coming from the MM9000.
Sound is more technicolor than water color, very 3-D. And there is not a trace of high frequency harshness or emphasis.
As G. Gordon Holt suggested back in that Fall 1991 TAS, the holographic speakers are paying dividends on the dramatically improved amplification.
I finally found a review on the M-6's in a magazine called CD Review. The whole year's (1992) issues were on sale in Ebay for less than $20. The author found them to be the most well-balanced, distortion and vice-free speakers of the group of "Gut-Wrenching" Tower speakers, including JBL's, Tannoy's, Boston Acoustics, and other very highly regarded brands.
Regarding the higher quality wiring, I am still never going to spend "Kimber" money on them, but the Master Series from Acoustic Research has added a significant enhancement to the sound, especially at the frequency extremes.
The speaker wire is 10 awg for the M6's, and 12 awg for the M5's that more resemble Boa Constrictors than speaker cable. You could tow the Titanic off the iceberg with the 10's!
The net result of all of this is that the presentation is far less stressed than before. Some really crappy recordings or sources can still sound pretty crappy. But some of the crappiness we may have thought we heard before may have been more the stress placed on our systems by some of the sources, particularly on the extreme high end frequency response.
My next acquistion, later this week, is finally getting a second Acoustic Research 112 12" 120-watt subwoofer. This is made possible by the 7.2 capabilities of the the SR 6005. The Audessey Multi-Eq has set the crossover of my M6's at 45 hz, and the M5's at 60 hz. The subs will be working only in the very low bass.
All of this is by way of asking mich pat: It's a big exciting world, full of increasingly more excellent equipment, so why are you switching from your AR 2ax and M-5?, and What are you replacing them with?
I'm betting you went back to the room tilt profile of the Advents. It is a distinctly different sound from the Holographic M Series. If you haven't replaced them yet, you might find nirvana with the Acoustic Reseach Hi-def series. The diamond plasma'd tweeters, meg-alloy mids in my R2 and R4 center channels from that series are very smooth and robust. The towers each contain a 2-12" subss powered by a Bob Carver Sunfire sub woofer amp. Julian Hirsch of Hirsch-Houck labs in Stereo Review felt they were more than a match with speakers 4-5x more expensive; and they were not cheap to begin with. Hirsch felt the base was strong and sublimely musical. You can find them every now and again on Ebay very reasonably priced.
Then, of course, if you have to have Advents, there is the legendary Double (Large) Advent approach that blew up the industry when they were discovered at a high-end store in New York.
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Michigan Pat,
I haven't been back here since my last post.
I'll save my follow-up on the M6's and more until I provide the pixs:)!!
It's all good!!
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Completed my speaker acquisitions.
One AR RC-2, a pair of AR M6's and a Bonus pair of M5's.
Yippee!!
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The only part of the HO series I've been exposed to is the AR4C center channel speaker.
I had a series of the cheaper soft dome tweeter/polypropylene mids AR center channels before getting this one. While the 2 different 5 1/4 mid-woofs put out better bass than the AR MC-1 Holographic imaging center channel I had before, began to notice how congested the sound was, the loss of fine inner details liked plucked strings on guitars and violins and cellos, breathing noises by singers, acoustic ambiance, etc.
Made my previously clear and transparent M-5 and M-4 system sound thick and unrefined.
Immediately after installing the 4C I bought on craiglist, the transparency and refinement was back along with the best bass response of all the previous AR center channels. It has palpably added to the quality and richness of the overall system bass response.
At $98 dollars, it was well-worth the investment.
Liked it so much, I am now bidding on 2C with the downward-firing 6 1/2 woofer on eBay. My goal is to have a system with all the extension, clarity and transparency of refined speakers like electrostats, planars and ribbons, and the power and dynamism of the largest cone systems, like Wilson and YG.Like a poor man's Magico Q5 or Dynaudio Utopia.
My Marantz SR 7200 is a 6.1 system, so there is room for both. 4C as rear center, 2C as front center.
Just missed out on a set of freshly restored M6's on eBay by $30.
Once I have those, I am done forever.
I am attaching fantastic article regarding speaker design that has really helped me understand and evolve my system intelligently by a guy named Lynn Olson. I have reread its 25 pages at least 6 times in the last 3 weeks. Absolutely fascinating!
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Missed you folks!
A couple of things you will find interesting.
I acquired another AR Center channel speaker, Acoustic Research PSC25, at a very low price to give to my brother for an HTS I am putting together for my him. He writes song and composes mnusic but only has a 5.1 desktop computer speaker system to listen to them on. I was curious about how this PSC25 sounded when I received them because they were so heavy. I inserted them into my system in place of the MC.1 for a brief audition.
The MC.1 HI is now anchoring the secondary system I have set up in my bedroom with the old JVC AVR and two pair of M-3's.
The reason is that the 2-5.25 mid-woofers in combination with the single silk dome tweeter produces much more abundant bass than the 3-3.5 inch mid-woofers in the MC.1's,l and has better power handling/dynamic range.
Unlike some of the reviews in AUDIOREVIEW.com, this is a completely sealed acoustic suspension speaker. It's voicing is very complementary tot he M5's and M-4's.
And as some commentators have stated, the closer you get to a true full-range speaker as your center channel speaker, the better the imaging you will achieve and overall sound quality you will experience.
The whole set-up is now more commanding while retaining the clean neutrality AR is known for.
Needless to say, my brother did not get that Acoustic Research PSC25 from me, though I am going to get another for him.
Secondly, as unique as the M-Series is, I have discovered other speakers manufacturers who have employed very similar cabinet designs to accomplish similar acoustical goals, including the best of them, the oddly named "Silent Speaker" from Direct Acoustics by Winslow Burhoe who apprenticed under Edgar Vilchur at AR. So-named because of its ability to disappear as the apparent sound source like our AR M-Series Holgraphic do. Others include the Sonab OA 116 Loudspeaker by Stig Carlsson, and the excellent Shahinian Arc Speaker. These were very highly regarded speakers in their day and still sell for top dollar when available.
I can't see how to attach the files about these "brother" speakers I compiled for you to enjoy.
Just e-mail me at lspain@pierce.ctc.edu and I can attach them to a reply. In reading about them, I experienced a sort of audiophile vindication as well as a lot of technical understanding that makes this (now legitimate) class of loudspeaker so enjoyable and so excellent!
The designers of all these speakers are acknowledged as some of the most respected and historically important in the business.
The best part is that for the most part, our AR M-Series seem to have benefited from their expriences and avoided some of the quirks and problems that some of them experienced.
Shahinian Arc Speakers-Paradise Gained - Tone Mag Test.pdf
SHAHINIAN’S COMPASS Loudspeaker A SEDUCTIVE PROPOSITION-HiFi 2008.pdf
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The model number of that center channel is the AR2C. I was wrong about the size of the woofer.
There are 32 reviews on it and basic product information on the Audio Review.com website at:
It is a very high-end piece that originally retailed for as much as $600.00.
MSRP: $ 600.00
Center channel with Plasma Transferred Diamond Hardened 1" Titanium Dome Tweeter, 6 1/2" High Excursion Down Firing Woofer, Dual 5 1/4" MagAlloy Monocoque Mid-Ranges
Their specs, 45hz to 22Khz, suggest they are wide-range enough they could be used in an elite bookshelf capacity, as well as a center channel speaker.
Freaks me out to think how a Bose-type Life Style System arrangement (5.1 with all AR2C's in conjunction with a subwoofer) would sound!
By the way, I scored a mint condition Marantz 7200 SR 6.1 dual room 105 watt (discrete amp per channel) receiver with a well-maintained Sony 135-watt per channel stereo integrated amplifier for bi-amping to the M5 woofers duty.
I'll be hooking up all this tastiness this weekend after I get the Marantz RC5200 touch screen remote to help with the set up.
I ordered three audiophile recordings to celebrate this system, including Ennio Morricone's "The Good , the Bad and the Ugly" soundtrack, Dire Straits, "Brothers in Arms", The Mercury Living Presnce Antal Dorati "1812 Overture"; all newly remastered for spectacular sound.
Hope this helps!
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Hey Thanks for all the input. You are right about a few things. First, I've had much larger center channels, but the small drivers in the MC1 reproduce Voice sound so clear and tight. The other night I was watching something that had auto fire gun shot scene with different fire arms. Boy did it sound so accurate.
Question for you about the MC1.
Do you know a link that has any info at all about it??? I'm trying to get the freq range so that I can set my Yamaha RX-V2500 receiver to the correct range of the speakers for the MC1 center channel. I cannot find anything any where about it. Also I can't hear sound coming from the 1 single speaker on the left side of the MC1 center speaker. Should all 3 woofers be playing the same, or it that a passive radiator?? I have not have it that long, or maybe a wire came loose behind it in the cabinet. I hope its not blown.
Second I kinda already found out that the M3's would be the best for fronts better than the M.5's I now have as fronts. I plan to move them to rear duty as I am now AB-ing a additional set of 3 ways fronts with them and that fills the bass. I really want to stay away from tower speakers because of room looks right now and only found 1 set of M3's but the shipping cost is to high. Do you still have your M3's and would you want to sell them if you do??
BTW I was shocked at the ability of the sound performance for music that the m.5 can play. I mean really shocked I had heard the the M.5 was the latest version of the M-1 and that the M-1 was almost too bright with highs. I think they may have tamed that down in the M.5. Or it may be that Yamaha RX-V2500 receiver I use is very neutral along with the profession grade Yamaha GQ2015A Dual-Channel 2/3-Octave Graphic Equalizer allows me to dial them in to my liking. The M.5 can hold is own when it comes to playing music. I don't worry about Bass to much because I use a M&K Volkswoofer for sub duty and it plays music like no others do.
I am attaching the AR Holographic Imaging Speaker Brochure for you. It is no longer available on this website.
However they did not include the specs on the MC1 Holographic Imaging Center speaker in it, though.
I read somewhere that it was 90hz to 22Khz, though. I would definitely set it for "Small" with your receiver.
When I listen to them up close, they sound like the bass is at least that low, maybe lower. They've got 3 5" Mid Woofers.
To my ears, all three of them are active radiators, though.
If you need to replace one of them, there are at least two OEM type acoustic research raw speaker websites listed in e-bay. The speaker itself would not be very expensive.
But be careful to seal it completely upon replacement. These are acoustic suspension speakers that depend on an air-tight seal to perform at their best.
There is a more expensive and very large AR center channel speaker that has two 8" radiators, though, if you're tending towards the HTS mode more than just music. It has very powerful bass! You can find several owner reviews on it at the "Epinions" website.
Your fronts should at least be Acoustic Research speakers in order to be "voiced" right.
One of the things that makes my new HTS set-up work so well is the seamless integration of the AR M5's, M4's, MC1 and M3's.
Any of the AR9(#) series should work very well.
These also have dual woofers with outstanding no-holds-barred bass. The narrow front cabinet dimensions also reduce diffraction effects and give an airy, wide-dispersion character very similar to the Holographic imaging series.
Julian Hirsch in Stereo Review back in the early 90's compared them very favorably to speakers costing 5-10 times the price:)!!!!!!!!!!
Haven't heard the MC.5's, but I am not surprised at your description of how good they sound. Acoustic Research pioneered dome speakers.
The brightness you observed might very well be a characteristic of your amplifier (rising high-end or lower than needed power capability).
So many other professional and owner reviews I have read about the Holographic imaging speaker series describe how the "hot high-end" frequency response leveled out when these speakers were later hooked up to very high-quality and/or more powerful amps.
Acoustic suspension speakers are notoriously inefficient. And so any power deficiencies would manifest themselves in a response pattern that would favor the high end over the low-end.
I am currently running my system through a low-end JVC 5.1 100-watt (RMS) per channel HTS receiver.
All that extra power has the high end sounding very well-balanced and smooth even on loud cymbal crashes; never hot or fizzy.
I would even characterize the tweeter balance as being somewhat subdued except, as it always is with Acoustic Research speakers in the case of low-bass and high end, when there really is prominent high-end sound.
I was watching a hybrid Hollywood/Bollywood movie, "Marigold" shot in India with Ali Larter in it.
Indian music has a surprisingly American quality when it comes to wide-range frequency response and dynamic range. Cymbals and bells are featured prominently and loudly. The M series speakers in my set-up reproduced them as a smooth high frequency shimmer with no "hotness" at all.
Since I am bidding on a 7.2 Sony HTS receiver, I am definitely keeping the M3's. But since the whole Holographic Imaging series is suddenly getting so popular, there are a number of M3 pairs for sale in the $150-200 range that are in "excellent" condition.
At this point, I would consider them worth it.
I am prepared to pay as much as twice that for the M6's I covet so much.
Have fun with your new set-up.
Make sure to let us know what front speakers you finally acquire and how the whole thing winds up sounding!!
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I just purchased a MC.1 Center and a set of nice M.5's. I was asking about the difference of the M.5 later series. I think the poster is very accurate about the difference of the M.5 and M1 being ported. They are very, very impressive, especially in the mid-range, and for a 4 inch woofer, not bad at all. I had heard that the M1 had a tendency to be too bright, but I think the M.5 was a improvement over the M1 with more mid-range, more bass and a little less highs.
I am now running them in a HT set up and I love it. Someone else where said when you play movies they give you that "right there" effect, and they do. They also fill the room with sound. I couldn't be happier.
I'm debating the M2 or M3 for fronts. Not if, but which one to get and then move the M.5 to the rear.
BTW - michiganpat, this is all your fault for bring this up, at the AK forum. LOL !
Congratulations on getting the MC1 along with the M.5's. Any M speaker pair provides very spacious sound.
But the MC! does "tighten up" the imaging/sound stage considerably.
I'm amazed at how often, especially in "Movie Mode", my HTS receiver is pumping at least 90% of the dialogue through the MC-1.
It's freed up the M-5's and M4's to create some really magical ambiance effects, especially in outdoor scenes of movies.
My personal recommendation for front M speakers:
- The M-3's are the only book shelf variety of the M series that are 3-ways. See brochure at
- They also possess a much larger acoustic suspension 8" woofer.
- That would provide you with very adequate clean, well-balanced bass output.
The much healthier power-handling of the M-3's would provide a substantial increase in dynamic range (softest, quietest sounds to loudest most powerful sounds) for your system, thus adding to the realism of your audio experience.
The M.5's would then not be asked to do something they can't, provide a realistic semblance of deep, powerful bass.
Within their limits, the M-3's are very surprising in their bass capabilities.
I had only the M-3's for approximately 3 weeks before I picked up the M-5's.
They constantly and pleasantly surprised me with their response.
They are well-balanced enough to be the only speakers in a truly Hifi "stereo" system.
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The Absolute Sound Magazine (TAS), Volume 16, #s 75-76 .
I bought it on E-Bay.
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After I recently got my first pair of M-3's on e-bay in June, I bought the TAS with the review of the M-1's referred to as well as the Stereo Review with the Julian Hirsch review of the M-4's and downloaded and then bought a physical copy of the M series brochure.
This was because the M-3's were a revelation, audibly. More than comparable to the late 70's AR-5's and AR-6's I had in my previously best-ever system
What was actually said in the TAS review is that Mark Levinson did, for a fact, use the M-1's to demonstrate his then $3,500 amplifiers. HP also testified that when he hooked up a pair of the M-1's to a premium amplifier, they went from being a very good speaker to a fantastic, state-of-the art-sounding loudspeaker.
He never said that the M-1's were the best of the M series, or that the larger models were inferior to the M-1's.
This motivated me to buy a pair of the M-5's from a wonderful shop from this website, and then a pair of M-4's as a set with the rare holographic imaging center speaker, the MC-1's, also from e-bay.
The performance breakdown is as follows:
The M-1's and M-2's are smaller speakers with less power handling and significantly less bass.
The M-3's,M4's and the very intriguing M-4.5's have much greater bass and power handling.
All of the above have far less sophisticated cross-overs and soft dome tweeters, than the top-of-the line M-5's and M-6's with their surprisingly sweet sounding aluminum tweeters.
It was because the M-3's were such a revelation, including surprisingly clean but respectable bass, that motivated my M-series shopping spree.
The M-5's were everything the M-3's were with the addition of bass so deep and powerful and clean that I never use the bass boost control on my receiver!
The M-4's are right in the middle of the M-3's and M-5's in terms of bass due to its 6" mid-range and 6" bass speakers vs. the 5" mid-range and 8" woofer of the M-5's.
The 8" woofer and 2.5" dome mid-range of the M-3's suffered slightly from not having the clever band-pass design with it's significant larger bass baffle volume of the M-4 and M-5's.
Power-handling and bass are the only significant differences with the 3 pairs that I have observed in my 3-month holographic imaging audio festival.
That is why I am absolutely determined to buy the first set of great condition M-6's with their dual 8" band-pass woofers.
They are all so good, I'm not selling any of them.
I was pleased to find out that some of the better 2-zone 7.1 receivers give you the option of having a pair of front high-positioned speakers (the M-3's?!) instead of a second zone in another room.
This adds height as well as more power handling and bass to the imaging of my system.
I will then acquire a good Class "D" sub woofer amp to bi-amp at least the M-6's, and possibly the M-5's with a 7.2 receiver.
By the way, the MC-1 is a powerful clean and neutral center speaker that really improves the precision of the positioning of the imaging.
While I acknowledge that there are certainly multi-Ten or Hundred Thousand dollar home theater set-ups that will sound better in some ways than my system, I am certain that I will be thrilled to listen to my vintage system.
Sort of like the difference between a BMW M3(pun intended!) versus a Ferrari 458.
At anything less than 160 mph, you'll never notice the superiority of the more powerful much more expensive car!!
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I was at the BAS (Boston Audio Society) meeting in May 1992 when the featured guest was John Buzzotta, the head engineer of the HI series. That meeting write-up is attached. I contacted the BAS's founder and he said it was fine to scan and post BAS articles. The only thing he asked was to provide a link to the BAS site, so here it is:
http://www.bostonaudiosociety.org/
Also in that issue is a discussion with Buzzotta about AR's plans to re-introduce the AR-3a into the American market in 1993-4. I don't believe that ever happened, but the "3a" model number did live on in various overseas (mostly Asian, I believe) markets. Ken Kantor's 303 came out in the US market very shortly after, in 1995.
There is also a meeting write-up from a 1993 BAS meeting that featured a tour of AR's Canton MA facility and their then-new Classic Series speakers and electronics.
Steve F.
Tthank-you very much for that attachment.
Always glad to get more backround on the M series speakers,
Acoustic Research AR M3 Holographic Imaging ???
in Acoustic Research
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Michigan Pat, Hope the employment thing has gotten better. Been there twice in this last highly unstable decade.
Look forwrd to hearing abobut your current forays into the world of high fidelity!