Reel Man Posted December 21, 2016 Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 First post! I thought I'd share my new to me AR3A's. I got these 2 weeks ago in an antique shop, that I went looking in for 10.5" reel to reel tapes, on a tip. There weren't any, just run of the mill Scotch 150 types, so I picked a few, and was about to go, when I spied familiar looking boxes - sure enough AR, and 3a's, at that. Neglected looking, moldy, but much more solid looking cabs than the AR3's that I'm going to do next(a lot more work). No price, so figuring that they might need slightly more work than usual, I decide $50 will be the limit, and ask him about them. He said he didn't know much about them(?), but said he'd take a fair price for them, and agreed to $50( probably could have gotten them for less, but I might stop by again). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel Man Posted December 21, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 The first thing I did, after checking the physical condition(bad surrounds on the woofers), was clean off the mould and such with orange oil. My other set will need a lot of woodwork, so I'm saving my ambition for them. They cleaned up quite well. You can see the mould and stain damages in the right light, but there are no scratches, and they look pretty darn good - a 7 or 8 out of 10. There is an excellent chance these will go into a bigger cabinet, so I wasn't going to obsess over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidDru Posted December 21, 2016 Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 Congrats! Looking forward to your progress on these. no doubt you will love them once complete. Be sure to download the AR3A restoration manual here in the library. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stupidhead Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 WOW! Nice rescue. Will be interesting to watch your progress, many pics please. welcome btw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel Man Posted December 22, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 It's not letting me upload any more pics for some reason.....but I'm listening to them now, with the bass off, as I haven't re-foamed them , yet. I'm off until Tuesday, and have a kit with shims. I cleaned the pots, as they weren't that bad, except one. I just sanded with 400 and 600 grit paper, and used some dielectric grease, to check the mids and tweeters; need to get/borrow an ohm meter, I guess, but they're working Quite well...listening to Miles ahead, stereo CD version. WOW, great imaging, and plenty of high end for me, and I'm a high end junkie.My goal is to have these basically done in the next week, to inspire me to fix the AR3's I've had a few years. This site will be very helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlsplace Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 Wow, welcome ... $50 is a bit shy of their current value I may have to plan a road trip to PA. Check your photo size if you are having problems uploading. Look forward to your progress Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ar_pro Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 Great catch - looking forward to photos! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel Man Posted December 22, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 That's better. Maybe a 6 or 7 out of 10, but still quite presentable. I have to think the often bad shape of these is why I've found them; I don't recall seeing any other quality speakers around, so maybe the good ones get snatched up quickly. I've had much better luck with reel to reel stuff here. Pa's economy during this general time span was quite robust, and people spent some serious money on their stereo's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel Man Posted December 22, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 The woofers were mouldy, especially this one. I took a 4" paint brush and some powdered comet , and cleaned it up quite a bit, but I still want to do more. I'm thinking a Clorox wipe, alcohol (dries quick), or sticking it in the sun this summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidDru Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 SOunds like a good plan. Nothing too wet if at all I was told when cleaning up my AR9 woofers that had remnants of splatterings on them. I think some of the guys have come up with ways to dye them too and they might chime in. My general guess on things is that the rotted deteriorated surrounds on speakers is often why these can be available so cheaply. Or they end up in the landfill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlsplace Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 10 hours ago, Reel Man said: The woofers were mouldy, especially this one. I took a 4" paint brush and some powdered comet , and cleaned it up quite a bit, but I still want to do more. I'm thinking a Clorox wipe, alcohol (dries quick), or sticking it in the sun this summer. Yikes, I prefer to use borax on mold: http://blacktoxicmolds.com/borax-kill-mold.php Borax is only slightly more toxic than common table salt. Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genek Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 Since the main component of a speaker that molds is the paper cone, I looked up recommendations for dealing with mold in books. The consensus from several conservators is that it's impossible to completely remove or kill all mold spores from paper, and that surface mold should be removed by physical means (brushing and vacuuming) only, They warn that the use of moisture on the surface, either by spraying or damp-wiping, will only drive mold spores deeper into the porous materials where they can grow again in the future if the environmental conditions that mold likes are not avoided. Chemicals like bleach or borax are only effective if you can fully soak the affected material. The most important warning from the conservators is not to attempt to cover the surface with any kind of "protective" coatings or finishes. Mold spores don't require oxygen to grow, and if you cover the surface in an attempt to conceal past stains or damage, you'll just be hiding any future growth until it's too late to avoid more damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel Man Posted December 23, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2016 Good to know. I figured comet powder would not be something mould would like. Since these woofers aren't sealed in with putty, like the earlier ones, I may just put them in sunlight, on a nice , dry day, to bake a bit. At any rate, these will be in a drier environment then they were in to get this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genek Posted December 23, 2016 Report Share Posted December 23, 2016 If you just sprinkled the cleanser on dry, it really isn't going to have any affect on the mold at all. It's not the heat from sunlight that helps sanitize, it's the UV. There's almost as much UV in diffuse sunlight as there is in direct, so you're better off doing it on an overcast day to avoid the danger of warping from heat. There's nothing to be gained by "baking" it. If you give the cone a brushing with a stiff bristle brush, vacuum it clean of the dust that generates, then keep it away from warm, moist conditions, nothing else short of dunking the whole thing in a bucket of bleach is going to do anything more against mold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dxho Posted December 23, 2016 Report Share Posted December 23, 2016 I wonder if fumigation would work- fill a large enough box with the appropriate gas and let it work. Or ozone blasting. I've used this generator on a car interior. Ozone in industrial quantities can kill surface mold, but a speaker cone is pretty thin. I already have the generator. I'd give it a try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genek Posted December 23, 2016 Report Share Posted December 23, 2016 Ozone exposure is what causes cracking in rubber, including foam. If the surrounds are shot anyway, might not be an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel Man Posted December 23, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2016 An overcast day sounds elegantly simple. The cabinet also was mouldy, so........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel Man Posted December 25, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 25, 2016 Well, no Xmas miracle. The distortion I heard in one woofer a few days ago (I played it very low, with the bass off on the tone control), did not disappear with a re-foam. Upon inspection, the voice coil has a crease in the middle. Guess I'll be sending this one out ( I'm thinking Millersound). Packing this will be more stress than the expense. The other woofer sounds OK, but the acoustic seal - isn't. I have pretty much the same material(It's kind of a plastic meringue ), but it would have been easier to cut that before I re-foamed it. Oh well. Can I use Elmer's glue for the mid screen? Tired of looking at the tape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlsplace Posted December 25, 2016 Report Share Posted December 25, 2016 I'd probably use E6000 black glue on the screen but Elmer's may be fine. RoyC can probably give you a definitive answer since he tweeks these for low output. He can probably clue you in on the options for the woofer as well. It is not obvious which woofer this is from your photos. If you are going to have Millersound do the work it would probably come out better if you sent in both woofers. Merry Xmas, Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel Man Posted December 25, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 25, 2016 This is the one with distortion. The crease you see running through the holes is absent on the other one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlsplace Posted December 25, 2016 Report Share Posted December 25, 2016 I noticed the former damage from bottoming out. Several adventuresome types have repaired broken formers on this forum previously. Seems like replacing the voice coils would be a better option though. Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel Man Posted December 25, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 25, 2016 I didn't realize this was the "Former" . The 3A resto page showed damaged assemblies as an example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel Man Posted December 27, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 27, 2016 How much does the center cone contribute to the acoustic seal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD70 Posted December 30, 2016 Report Share Posted December 30, 2016 You got a great deal on those! The cabs look very good after the work you did. With that much mold, I'd be looking for correct replacements on line. Mold is nasty stuff and the less of it in the house, the better. Keep the pics coming as you progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reel Man Posted April 2, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2017 An update. I went ahead ordered a last generation replacement AR woofer from Ebay, but it showed up on the coldest day of the year, and made a crunching sound- not good. I returned it , and eventually sent my old one to Roy. This is what he found.... no wonder it sounded bad.....but this is why it was parked in the basement, and eventually made it's way to me. Roy managed to fix it, and it's on it's way back. I have a 6uf poly capacitor, and this will be an Easter vacation project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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