AR-91, what is a reasonable price?

[Guest Sweden]

Hi Nigel,

believe it or not but my TV is also starting to make that crackling sound that my speakers are doing and I'm thinking about if there could be some kind of disturbance here between the speakers, amplifier and TV?!

I have a 29" Sony, a heavy piece, that weighs about 56 kilograms. I then have the AR-6 speakers appr. 40 centimeters from the TV on either side. The amplifier is just beside the TV on the right side, less than 10 centimeters from the TV and right beside one of the AR-6. The AR-91 are right besides the AR-6 on either side, which means appr. 1 meter from the TV-set. So everything is within 3 meters.

It's like the following:

AR-91 - AR-6 - TV - Amplifier - AR-6 - AR-91

The biggest problem is on the "amplifier-side".

Note 1. When I heard it on the tv tonight, no other equipment was switched on.

Note 2. When we hear it on the speakers, the tv is usually not on. I also always only have the AR-91 on.

Could the placing/closeness between equipments be a problem eventhough no power is switched on as described above under note 1 and 2?

Thanks

Rickard

[Guest dogmeninreno]

>Hi Nigel,

>

>believe it or not but my TV is also starting to make that

>crackling sound that my speakers are doing and I'm thinking

>about if there could be some kind of disturbance here between

>the speakers, amplifier and TV?!

>

>I have a 29" Sony, a heavy piece, that weighs about 56

>kilograms. I then have the AR-6 speakers appr. 40 centimeters

>from the TV on either side. The amplifier is just beside the

>TV on the right side, less than 10 centimeters from the TV and

>right beside one of the AR-6. The AR-91 are right besides the

>AR-6 on either side, which means appr. 1 meter from the

>TV-set. So everything is within 3 meters.

>

>It's like the following:

>AR-91 - AR-6 - TV - Amplifier - AR-6 - AR-91

>

>The biggest problem is on the "amplifier-side".

>

>Note 1. When I heard it on the tv tonight, no other equipment

>was switched on.

>

>Note 2. When we hear it on the speakers, the tv is usually not

>on. I also always only have the AR-91 on.

>

>Could the placing/closeness between equipments be a problem

>eventhough no power is switched on as described above under

>note 1 and 2?

>

>Thanks

>Rickard

I haven't heard of the speakers interfering with the TV's other than magnetic problems and that will usually effect the screen and not the sound.

>Do you have your TV hooked thru your amp that drives the 91's? If not, Do you have any Amature radio operators near you?

You could probably try a power line conditioner and I would recommend an Adcom about $100.00US on eBay. Keep us posted,

Dale in Reno, Nv.....

[Guest Sweden]

Hi Dale,

thanks for your reply. My wife and I share your view regarding magnetic fields, i.e. that they should only interfere with the picture.

Regarding radio-amateurs, you bring up an interesting issue. I live in a 6 stories high student apartment-building. I have no idea if there are any radio-amateurs around. But what I do know is that the opposite building has a lot of antennas on top of it (for mobile-phones, gsm and 3G-standard) and my wife has heard that it is worse to live in the next building rather than in the same.

If these kinds of antennas can interfer in high frequencies, I have no clue? I don't have any expertise in the area. They were quite recently put there so.....?

The tv is quite new (around 2 years) so I doubt that it is malfunctioning.

Cheers

Rickard

[Guest dogmeninreno]

>Hi Dale,

>

>thanks for your reply. My wife and I share your view regarding

>magnetic fields, i.e. that they should only interfere with the

>picture.

>

>Regarding radio-amateurs, you bring up an interesting issue. I

>live in a 6 stories high student apartment-building. I have no

>idea if there are any radio-amateurs around. But what I do

>know is that the opposite building has a lot of antennas on

>top of it (for mobile-phones, gsm and 3G-standard) and my wife

>has heard that it is worse to live in the next building rather

>than in the same.

>

>If these kinds of antennas can interfer in high frequencies, I

>have no clue? I don't have any expertise in the area. They

>were quite recently put there so.....?

>

>The tv is quite new (around 2 years) so I doubt that it is

>malfunctioning.

>

>Cheers

>Rickard

Rickard, Finding this type of problem can be quite difficult to isolate. If your power supply is 120VAC (depending what country you are residing in) I would try a powerline conditioner like the Adcom 515 first. Also be sure the system is properly grounded or completly isolated from ground. Here is a interesting link:

C:Documents and SettingsdefaultDesktopACA Licensing Citizen Band Radio and Your Audio Equipment.htm

This is an article about interference in audio equipment. Try getting up early and listening when the transmitters might be off air. Good luck! Dale

[Guest Sweden]

Hi again,

I have now scanned through the HT-market and the suggestions in this thread and I have some models which I would appreciate your thoughts in relations to my speakers.

- NAD T763

- DENON 3805

- Harman Kardon AVR 630

- Harman Kardon AVR 8500 (pre-owned, said to be purchased 2 months ago (has receipt and warranty), is selled due to a purchase of a Marantz AV-12)

All except the 630 will cost the same. I don't plan to have more than 4 speakers, so that is not an issue. The only thing I want is to get a better bass and to get rid of the scraping sound (which I fear could be clipping).

So, what would you recommend?

Thanks

Rickard

[Guest dogmeninreno]

>Hi again,

>

>I have now scanned through the HT-market and the suggestions

>in this thread and I have some models which I would appreciate

>your thoughts in relations to my speakers.

>

>- NAD T763

>- DENON 3805

>- Harman Kardon AVR 630

>- Harman Kardon AVR 8500 (pre-owned, said to be purchased 2

>months ago (has receipt and warranty), is selled due to a

>purchase of a Marantz AV-12)

>

>All except the 630 will cost the same. I don't plan to have

>more than 4 speakers, so that is not an issue. The only thing

>I want is to get a better bass and to get rid of the scraping

>sound (which I fear could be clipping).

>

>So, what would you recommend?

>Thanks

>Rickard

Where did the interference (or whatever)go? How did you solve the problem? Dale

[Guest Sweden]

Hi Dale,

the sound-problem is still there. The pattern is the same. When the amp is cold, no sound-problem. After 4-5 songs, the scraping sound starts to appear ON CERTAIN CD'S AND SONGS. Again, the first time I play a song where this problem occurs (i.e. the amp is cold at this point), the sound is very good. If I then replay the same song or play a CD where I have the problem, the scraping sound (almost as if the tweeters where blown) occurs after 4-5 songs. I can switch between all my four different speakers. The same sound appears on all four speakers at appr. the same point and with the exact same sound-issue in all speakers. I had the problem on my AR6s before I purchased the 91s. Sadly, I can't recall how my old Fisher-speakers sounded.

The good news is that this sound-issue only appears on few of our records. Examples of CDs are Journey (Frontiers), some of my wifes new age records and MSG (Built to destroy). It's like a combination of a sharp high freq. combined with a non-pure signal (probably a bad recording from the start). Sometimes it is enough with just the sharp sound. (Journey where famous for their "sharp" sound but the speakers should be able to handle that, especially since I play at low volumes.)

So I suspect that the amp is bad and I guess that when the TV started to have a similar sound-issue, this must just be a freak accident???!!! Since I alreday have decided to buy a HT, I will go through with this. I guess that I will know if it was the amp or if it's interference/4 bad tweeters after playing 4-5 songs from my "favourite" CDs

I certainly hope that it is not the tweeters, then I need to find fitting tweeters for my 91s and 6s and that seems to be a bit hard. Especially since I live in Sweden. In that case, I guess that I would have to find good enough matches?

I'll keep you all posted and I appreciate some comments on the HTs I have listed.

Thanks

Rickard

[Guest Sweden]

Hi all,

I have some bad (?) news!

I borrowed an HT, an Arcam AVR200, and connected it to my AR91 and the 'scraping' sound was still there, albeit significant less.

So in worst case, it is all 4 tweeters that are bad.....

Is there any way to visually see if anything is starting to deteriorate?

Is there any other method to investigate?

What could be wrong?

When just looking at them they look like new!

Can you recommend good tweeters besides ARs original (if any). The original are quite hard to find here in Sweden.

Thanks

Rickard

[Guest Bret]

>What could be wrong?<

Capacitors?

You know, AR tweeters are usually accused of being too subdued. A "scraping" sound coming from them would be unusual unless they were blown. The idea that you have four tweeters are all blown, but that you can only hear it after your amplifier has played a while, and only on certain songs, just seems weird and strange.

I believe everything you have said, but I really want to believe there must be a better explanation for what you are hearing than blown tweeters.

There's not much point in your buying a set of AR-91s and then replacing the tweeters with something else. It wouldn't sound like a set of AR-91s.

I just keep coming-back to the extremely unlikey set of circumstances that would have to exist for all four tweeters to exhibit the same strange symptoms you have described.

I keep concluding that all four tweeters are almost surely not all bad in a very odd and specific way and if they were you wouldn't have to play "some songs" and it wouldn't take several minutes for them to start breaking-up and scraping.

But I can't know that.

Before you replace drivers, is there somewhere you could take them where someone might be able to diagnose the trouble? Is there a repair service that might be able to test the crossover components?

I would just encourage you to do whatever you can before replacing drivers with non-AR products.

Bret

[Guest Sweden]

Hi Bret (and all others)

I will NOT replace the drivers until I have tried 'everything'. Perhaps not even then as well. I mean, the speakers sounds great on most my and my wifes records. It's only under 'stress' at high freq. when this seems to occur. I'm a 'freak' when it comes to preserving original stuff. Hey, I even buy original parts to my old Volvo from -88.

I'm a logical guy and I work in a logical business (IT) and I hate these kinds of defects. The part I dislikes the most is just the fact that it sounds good for the first 10-20 minutes or so and then the scraping sounds occurs. Now I have tried with switching my speakers, switching signal-source and switching amp. What I will try next is to bring the speakers to a local shop and audition them on 2-3 different amps and see if the problem exists there as well. I will bring my records with the problem and I will try them on one amp where my AR91 and the shops speakers are connected.

If I had a digital-camera I would take a photo and post it. All drivers are in a beautiful shape. There is no visual evidence at all of anything being wrong.

For you who have experienced blown tweeters, can you describe the sound?

At least I have something to do on my sparetime. :-)

Thanks

Rickard

[Guest Sweden]

Hi Bret,

you get two replies on your last message.

I have been thinking about capacitor and I found an article on the net in swedish and when the author described problems and symptoms when having problem with aging capacitors, I could recognize my problems. I think your idea could be it.

So I will start with my AR6 and replace the capacitor in one of the speaker and then evaluate teh result. I speaker-repair shop I discussed this with also recommended me to replace the resistor if it was in cheramic to a resistor in metal. They also recommended to change the wiring.

So, some of questions:

- Is it just to buy a capacitor with the same measurement or should it be a "special" kind of capacitor?

- Is it easy to replace the capacitor in the AR6 and AR91?

- Should I also change resistor and cable or just use the ones that are there. If I should change them, any particular resistor or cable?

- Anything else to think about before starting this project? I'm a complete virgin in this area.....

Thanks

Rickard