owlsplace Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 6 minutes ago, Evol2121 said: Capacitors I'm looking at. I wanted to run them by yall. https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/solen-capacitors/solen-4-mfd-fast-cap-400v/ https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/solen-capacitors/solen-6-mfd-fast-cap-400v/ So two 4mdf and two 6mdf for the pair of speakers. The 400v rating is ok right? The original being 50v I generally use the Carli's: https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/carli-capacitors/carli-mylar-3.9-mfd/ https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/carli-capacitors/carli-mylar-6-mfd/ You might want to put some painter's tape over that loose veneer until you decide what to do with the cabs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evol2121 Posted April 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 Ok. I really have no clue as to the advantages or disadvantages of the capacitor type/brand so I'm in the dark on this. Again I really appreciate yalls advice. Here is some sealer from vintage AR on Ebay http://www.ebay.com/itm/ACOUSTIC-RESEARCH-SPEAKER-CABINET-SEALER-/191665491952?hash=item2ca0274ff0:m:m6TA0L-pGcNuqcvpEWx3Ozw seems inexpensive. Anyone try this stuff? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlsplace Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 1 minute ago, Evol2121 said: ... http://www.ebay.com/itm/ACOUSTIC-RESEARCH-SPEAKER-CABINET-SEALER-/191665491952?hash=item2ca0274ff0:m:m6TA0L-pGcNuqcvpEWx3Ozw seems inexpensive. Anyone try this stuff? Duct seal at Home Depot or Lowes and/or automotive body putty -- I believe it is all the same stuff. I prefer the foam tape for ease of use and getting back into the cabs available from Parts Express or on Amazon: http://www.parts-express.com/parts-express-speaker-gasketing-tape-1-8-x-3-8-x-50-ft-roll--260-540 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evol2121 Posted April 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 Ok. Yes getting the woofers out was more difficult than I first anticipated. I'm going to need to buy some speaker wire to put these guys back together. Does the gauge matter between all the parts? In other words if I get a gauge that is larger enough for the capacitors, can I use this gauge on the pots too. I'm just a little worried that I'm not going to have enough length on some of those wires especially to the pots. They were pretty much straight shots point to point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lARrybody Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 The Solen caps will work just fine. You might also consider looking at these. http://www.erseaudio.com/Products/PulseX250v/MPX25-03-3-90 http://www.erseaudio.com/Products/PulseX250v/MPX25-03-6-00 I am partial to the Dayton's from Parts Express, but what you picked are fine. As far as sealing the cloth surrounds on your woofers, don't use anything from the auto parts store. Your surrounds may be just fine. If they fail the push test after they are reassembled you will want the stuff from Vintage AR. Even if you do not want to do the cabs now, I would take GD70's direction and stabilize the MDF with the epoxy. Get some 16 or 18 gauge stranded copper hook up wire from the local ACE Hardware. You can buy it by the foot and by the color. You are going to like what you hear when finished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evol2121 Posted April 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 Excellent. I'll let my dad look at the cabinet and see if he has the right epoxy. I may be able to get the original seal back on there. I rolled the stuff up into a ball. A lot of it stayed on the woofer and where the woofer frame sits on the cabinet. I was going to scrape it off and apply new stuff but I'll be honest, with as pliable as the stuff on there was I was tempted to put it back together with the original stuff. I read that using hot glue to attach the caps was not recommended. The boxes from the old caps are kinds messed up as I tore into them to see what the inside look like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stan461 Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 Thanks for doing the lookup on the Solens. I have used Solens in the past and they worked out great. But the Carli caps that Roger suggested will do just as well for a less money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stupidhead Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 and there it is. all the options noted for caps will be a significant improvement over OEM. the rule of thumb I use is exact value replacements with a 5%+/- tolerance or less, but again that is my approach. Voltage greater than OEM is fine (and better). Vintage AR is a good resource but the sealer is no different than the duct seal at Lowes. The surround sealant is another thing entirely. I suspect you are using tmad's pot guide and I seem to recall a reference to using a permatex product for sealing cloth surrounds. Not good guidance in this case, use the stuff developed by Roy sold by vintage ar if you want the best proven and tested product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evol2121 Posted April 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 Ok guys. So I soaked the pots in vinegar and...well maybe left them too long? They are no longer copper in color in most spots. They look more silverish. Have I ruined them? I had given them an initial deoxit/sandpaper scrub to try to get off some of the corrosion, then I put them in vinegar/salt to soak...and then my mom came over and we started talking....and then they turned silver : ( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlsplace Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 1 hour ago, Evol2121 said: Ok guys. So I soaked the pots in vinegar and...well maybe left them too long? They are no longer copper in color in most spots. They look more silverish. Have I ruined them? I had given them an initial deoxit/sandpaper scrub to try to get off some of the corrosion, then I put them in vinegar/salt to soak...and then my mom came over and we started talking....and then they turned silver : ( Vinegar plus salt, right? Need photos to evaluate but I doubt you ruined them. Pouring some boiling water on them will help remove the cleaning solution and the heat will dry them fast. You need to scrub/polish and de-oxit again. You are not trying to remove the silver plating. Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlsplace Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 1 hour ago, larrybody said: I am partial to the Dayton's from Parts Express, but what you picked are fine. I think the Dayton caps are made by ERSE IIRC: http://www.erseaudio.com/Products/PulseX Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evol2121 Posted April 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 Yes vinegar and salt. At first it looked like what was under the corrosion was copper in color. Then after the soak I see a lot of silver. 3 came pretty clean, the 4th not as clean. I'll have to go at it again. Here are some pics. I hope you can see the silver I'm talking about. The one that didn't come clean is obvious. I did pick up some 18 gauge wire today. Unfortunately the ACE I went to did not have a good color selection. In fact for the 18 gauge with the multiple interior wires (not just one thick wire) they only had white. The colored ones were all 12 gauge. Out of curiosity, what exactly makes one choose one capacitor over another? I have no idea how they work but I can only assume the construction material must vary by manufacturer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JKent Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 Quote Out of curiosity, what exactly makes one choose one capacitor over another? I have no idea how they work but I can only assume the construction material must vary by manufacturer. Oh no! Ask this on "some" forums and you'll start debates about the merits of various high-priced caps. For the more reasonable (most CSP members) there are essentially 2 types: Electrolytic and film. Most old speakers used electrolytics. They were cheap and of a manageable size. When replacing caps most of us here prefer film, not because they're "better" but because they last virtually forever. For smaller values this works out fine but when you get above 20uF or so the film caps become large and expensive, and then many of us use NPEs (non-polar electrolytics). Dayton caps from PE were mentioned. They're fine. Some opt for Solen, which cost a tad more. Madisound has Carli caps in some values and they are less expensive than poly (they're Mylar) but still film and a good choice. RoyC (I think) has commented that Carlis are good because their ESR is closer to that of the original electrolytics. I'm sure others will weigh in but IMHO if you shop for a brand name from a reputable seller you can pretty much choose according to cost. For the 2ax you have a 6uF and a 4uF (IIRC) o film is the way to go. You could use a Carli 3.9uF and Carli 6,0uF. -Kent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evol2121 Posted April 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 13 minutes ago, JKent said: Oh no! Ask this on "some" forums and you'll start debates about the merits of various high-priced caps. For the more reasonable (most CSP members) there are essentially 2 types: Electrolytic and film. Most old speakers used electrolytics. They were cheap and of a manageable size. When replacing caps most of us here prefer film, not because they're "better" but because they last virtually forever. For smaller values this works out fine but when you get above 20uF or so the film caps become large and expensive, and then many of us use NPEs (non-polar electrolytics). Dayton caps from PE were mentioned. They're fine. Some opt for Solen, which cost a tad more. Madisound has Carli caps in some values and they are less expensive than poly (they're Mylar) but still film and a good choice. RoyC (I think) has commented that Carlis are good because their ESR is closer to that of the original electrolytics. I'm sure others will weigh in but IMHO if you shop for a brand name from a reputable seller you can pretty much choose according to cost. -Kent Yeah in my short reading over of the threads that pop up on google I can see that some people make a big deal out of it. I did find what one guy said interesting. He claimed that out of all the components that one could upgrade, caps would be down on his list. His opinion was that there were so many points at which sound degradation (his goal was a black background, and I think I understand his meaning) could occur. For example the resistor in the tweeter may not jive well with a new cap, and all the new cap would do is highlight that the resistor/tweeter aren't happy (I'm paraphrasing of course). This makes me wonder if the Carlis will sound better because they get along with the other speaker components better Obviously I have to buy new caps because I've dismantled the others but I'm of a borderline compulsive nature and have a hard time pulling the trigger on things where there is such contention and the stakes are so high!!!! : ) I've read up and the consensus seems to be that Dayton, Solen, and Carli are good caps. Some suggested Clarity or Jantzen as a step up without breaking the bank. I think Carlis will probably fit the bill. I'm sure they'll do fine. Just out of curiosity though, would the Solten produce a "brighter" sound? Is this the type of difference people are talking about? Or is it a background noise issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lARrybody Posted April 8, 2016 Report Share Posted April 8, 2016 2 hours ago, owlsplace said: I think the Dayton caps are made by ERSE IIRC I was under the impression that the Dayton's are made by Bennic Capacitors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidDru Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 Frankly I am just happy when one of those brands has all the values I am looking for so I only pay shipping once! Otherwise JKent sums it up for ya. Add Erse to the shopping options. Remember to put everything you might need in the order before paying. Caps, resistors, lpads, wire, solder, solder wick, and etc... Parts express will have that nice driver gaskets to make sure they are air tight again when installed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ar_pro Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 10 minutes ago, DavidDru said: Remember to put everything you might need in the order before paying. That's the truth - and don't forget nylon zip ties and hot glue sticks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evol2121 Posted April 9, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 See I've read so much that stuff is blurring together. So there's no issue hot gluing the caps to the cabinet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dxho Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 Many options - I staple tie wraps to the cabinet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dxho Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 dupe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlsplace Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 6 hours ago, Evol2121 said: . Just out of curiosity though, would the Solten produce a "brighter" sound? Is this the type of difference people are talking about? Or is it a background noise issue? If you are looking for a brighter sound caps won't do it for you. There may be some very slight issues as the dielectric burns-in. Personally I never noticed this with my old ears but here is an old post that may offer some insight: 5 hours ago, larrybody said: I was under the impression that the Dayton's are made by Bennic Capacitors. You are probably correct on that. Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlsplace Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 3 hours ago, Evol2121 said: See I've read so much that stuff is blurring together. So there's no issue hot gluing the caps to the cabinet? Hot gluing npe caps might be okay but I would pass on hot gluing film caps. Goop, silicone, wire ties, etc. -- the KISS method works for me Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ar_pro Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 3 hours ago, Evol2121 said: See I've read so much that stuff is blurring together. So there's no issue hot gluing the caps to the cabinet? There are a number of ways to skin this particular cat, that's for certain. AR's standard practice for the AR-9 series was lots & lots of hot glue for the caps & coils (photo of AR-91 crossover attached). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlsplace Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 5 minutes ago, ar_pro said: There are a number of ways to skin this particular cat, that's for certain. AR's standard practice for the AR-9 series was lots & lots of hot glue for the caps & coils (photo of AR-91 crossover attached). Looks like they hot glued a couple of film caps there. I guess one would have to look the manufacturers specs for heat ratings but now that I think about it a little hot glue on the hands isn't all that unbearable Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidDru Posted April 9, 2016 Report Share Posted April 9, 2016 I used these. Zip tie thingys that were attached with some glue and screws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.