Guest Brian_D Posted December 9, 2003 Report Share Posted December 9, 2003 I know from previous questions and research that the 18 and the 18s are nearly identical with the exception of tweeter placement.I also know that the drivers housed in a 17 are identical to those found in an 18 of the same age/era.If these two statements are true, then I should be fairly certain that the drivers used in any 18 or 18s are the same as those used for the 17, correct?Please check me on this; I've scored a pair of 18s speakers with less-than-perfect cabinets, while I have a pair of 17 speakers with crappy pioneer non-original drivers. (The one and only time I've been screwed by ebay) I would like to drop the 18s drivers into the 17 cabinet, but I'm unsure that the drivers are identical.I'll put the Pioneer drivers in the 18s cabinet and banish them to the garage! (For use of course!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nigel Posted December 9, 2003 Report Share Posted December 9, 2003 Do it. Should work well, and fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brian_D Posted December 16, 2003 Report Share Posted December 16, 2003 Well, the speakers (model 18s) arrived today. The cabinets were as expected, the PO said they were "rough" and indeed they were.The thing I'm irritated about is that the post said they "sounded great" and were "well used but well matintained." Well, I didn't even try them because the woofer surrounds were shot. (Very large gaps in the surround, one almost completely gone)I don't know if it's just me, but a "well maintained" speaker would have surrounds in tact, even if deteriorating as expected, it should be nearly all there... oh well, at least that's easy to fix. Just rambling, but it does look like I'll get a working pair of 17's out of the deal after re-surrounding, and a pair of "junkers" for the garage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bret Posted January 3, 2004 Report Share Posted January 3, 2004 Brian,How did the 17 project turn-out? I'm sitting in the bedroom listening to mine (a little Chopin followed by some Mendelsson) and I'm still in love. Whatever they lack in energy at either end they completely make-up for in balance.I cheat a little (using the tone controls to compensate for placement). Just wondering what your experience of them is.Bret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brian_D Posted January 6, 2004 Report Share Posted January 6, 2004 I have two pair now and I love them both. The "converted" pair (using AR18s drivers) seems slightly "brighter" than the other, though this might be an artifact of my amplifier's A/B switch (with load compensation circuit)Another difference I noted when rebuilding these is that the AR 17 driver (originaly with mesh/cloth dustcap) had a "plug" over the voice coil, I assume to seal it off from whatever might come through that dustcap. The 18 and 18s I've re-foamed had a solid paper or rubber dustcap and no "plug". (the plug to which I'm referring is simply a thick piece of pressboard, cut in a circle and glued in place directly over the voice coil)In (all three) sets I've refoamed now, I've just made sure the seal around the duscap is good, and not replaced the plug... I've noticed no difference at all in before/after or set to set besides cabinet artifacts (extension)I have one set in the office and the other in the basement as surrounds. Since my projector just died (P.O.S.) I'll probably bring them upstairs to my front room to replace the 9's I took to the basement. The bastardized 18s's are banished to the garage for grunge and 70's rock listening while wrenching on the Triumph!-Brian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brian_D Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 I guess I just realized what you were really asking... I have always preferred the 17 over most any other speaker I've owned, old or new, including some Boston Acoustic bookshelfs, Sony ES trap towers, Event powered monitors and some others. I've always found their tone to be so well matched to my preference that it's like we were meant for eachother.Your comment about "energy" is accurate; certainly from a measurement standpoint they could stand to gain in both directions. However, I find that just as I feel the highs are getting dull or the low end is lacking in some way, the track changes and it's a whole new speaker. That's the true measure of ballance in a speaker to my mind; when tracks or artists or albums change, is it obvious that it isn't the same recording/board/engineer/producer/instrument/what have you.The wife and kid were away yesterday afternoon, and I had an opportunity to listen to Davis' "Kind of Blue" (Second CD release) at a volume which is usualy not permitted in my home Once I got aclimated to the relatively high noise floor in that recording I was stunned by the depth of these relatively simple speakers which left nothing unrepresented, I could even hear the sax (can't recall the artist) and Miles cleaning out their spitvalves just before soleys.I hesitate to say this, and every time I do someone shudders on this forum, but in some cases I actually prefer listening to these 17's to my 9's. The Davis recording is a prime example. When I listen to it on the 9's I just can't get past the tape hiss, the sax breath is too pronounced and during some very high energy passages the tape compression in the low end is just too obvious. Maybe the 17's are just "imperfect" enough, where the 9's are just too perfect!I expected some of the same from a pair of 18's I refoamed for a friend and was disappointed. The lack of low-end extension was much more pronounced, and there seemed to be a bit of a rough spot in the crossover range. Vocals were a bit strained and organ solos seemed to come from out of nowhere, as if the speakers were out of phase in just a specific frequency range. I thought it might be placement, so I put them exactly where I usualy listen to my 17's and it wasn't any better. But my friend loves them in the same ways I love my 17's so more power to him.Do you listen to much other than orchestral on these speakers? I've never been a fan of orchestral music to the point that I can just sit and listen. I'm mostly a Jazz/Blues guy but known to rock a bit when the time is right. I'm really into this "singer-songwriter" movement that started with Dave Matthews. Follwing behind were John Mayer (LOVE Heavier Things... great album) Jason Mraz and some others... The girls started earlier, I suppose they've always been s-s, as opposed to bands. I can listen to Joplin, I love Bic Runga and Alana Davis, I can stand Fiona Apple most of the time, but I draw the line at Sara MacLachlan, though she's one of my wife's favorites.What ever I listen to, it's always on the 17's in the office. When I actually do have the opportunity to really push the 9's it's short lived, but I'm always in awe of them. I don't think I'll ever push them to their limits, I just can't afford the wattage! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bret Posted January 8, 2004 Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 >Do you listen to much other than orchestral on these speakers?<Yes, I do, but you wouldn't approve, I'm afraid. Are you familiar with Disturbed? (okay guys, stop throwing things - I didn't say you had to listen to them)I tend to listen to either classical recordings (sometimes chamber music, not full symphony) or. . can you say "Heavy Metal" on an AR forum? Well, I'm not sure how "heavy" Bowie is. . . but my musical tastes and my collection pretty-much run to extremes. I don't have much esoteric, but then I still think of Procol Harum as "pretty deep."I haven't heard anything on the 17s that I was terribly disappointed with. I knew not to try pipe organ. If my Arlo Guthrie and Leon Redbone records (CDs) count as singer-songwriter music, then I've enjoyed the 17s with s-s music.I love the speakers, myself. They made me recently ask myself, "Why would anyone stop making this speaker?" In fact, you could almost go straight down the Truth in Listening series and ask that question of every one of them.Bret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninohernes Posted January 8, 2004 Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 >I tend to listen to either classical recordings (sometimes>chamber music, not full symphony) or. . can you say "Heavy>Metal" on an AR forum? Well, I'm not sure how "heavy" Bowie>is. . . but my musical tastes and my collection pretty-much>run to extremes. I don't have much esoteric, but then I still>think of Procol Harum as "pretty deep."Mine too. I listen to everything too from Aaron Copland to Led Zeppelin. Thats what makes the vintage AR's so great, they can reproduce everything from the pounding bass in rock to the sweetest violin in a Beethoven quartet.>I tend to listen to either classical recordings (sometimes>chamber music, not full symphony)I love chamber music! I record for a chamber music group here in my area, they are really great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
administrator Posted January 17, 2004 Report Share Posted January 17, 2004 Bret:Disturbed? You need to crank those speakers up a little more before we (well, I) start throwing things! My AR's have been fed a steady dose of Megadeth (Cryptic Writings especially), Tool, Down .. you get the picture. AR's are great speakers.A coworker of mine came over last year and listened to a few Dido tracks and then A Perfect Circle on my 303a's. He went out and bought a pair of 302's!Classical is interesting .. but sometimes you need to shake the dust off.Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bret Posted January 18, 2004 Report Share Posted January 18, 2004 >Classical is interesting .. but sometimes you need to shake the dust off<Shake the dust off sounds right, or maybe for me it's pour off the formaldehyde.I was listening to Black Sabbath a little while ago. Stuck in the 70s I guess. When Ozzy dies it'll be time for me to go home, myself.Bret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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