Guest bubbas_buddy Posted February 8, 2003 Report Share Posted February 8, 2003 I just pulled the drivers out of an old pair of AR11's that haven't been used in years. I need suggestions that I can perform to determine if any of the drivers are good. Any suggestion appreciated.Buddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 9, 2003 Report Share Posted February 9, 2003 >I need suggestions that I can perform to determine if any of the drivers are good<Do you have any reason to think that the drivers you pulled are bad? In fact, why'd you pull them? Are the cabinets destroyed?It isn't quite like a lightbulb (burning or not), but the odds are that if the drivers work they will sound okay and if they sound okay, they probably are okay.But to know that they need to be in a working speaker system and preferably there should be two you can compare the sound of. Of course, if you have access to some test equipment you could check your perceptions. Your perceptions are probably pretty good, though.If a driver sounds all wrong, then swap cabinets and see if it sounds all wrong in the other cabinet. If it doesn't, then maybe you have a crossover problem in the first cabinet.Sometimes this stuff can be awfully subtle, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bubbas_buddy Posted February 9, 2003 Report Share Posted February 9, 2003 Hello Bret, and thanks for your reply. I posted yesterday while in a hurry for work, so I'll add a little more info.My brother bought the AR11's around 1977. He used them for a few years and thereafter stored them. They haven't been used in nearly 20 years. The oiled Walnut cabinets are fine save a water stain on one speaker. The grills and badges are there, although one badge is solid brass and the other brown aluminum. I have the original boxes and manuals.The woofer foam surrounds are gone. The 1 1/2" dome mids look new. The 3/4" dome highrange drivers appear excellent. After removing the drivers it appears that the batting has never been touched. I was called in to work before I had a chance to inspect the crossovers.Considering their condition I did not think it wise to wire to my receiver for testing. I wanted to check the mid and hirange units before paying to have the woofer surrounds replaced. That brings me back to my original question.Although the speakers are too nice to throw out, I am not willing to spend a large amount of money on them. I have a house full of speakers now. I wanted to simply HEAR them with one of my tube amps/turntable. They are beauties.Buddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Barrydor Posted February 9, 2003 Report Share Posted February 9, 2003 I would replace the mids and the tweeters and then disconnect the woofers. Making sure that the woofer leads are not shorted to each other, play some music through them to verify that the drivers play without disortion.If the drivers work, it is very unlikely that there is a problem with the crossover and it does not pay to tear into it until the above experiment is performed. As Bret said, if there is a problem here, the next step would be swapping drivers, but this listening test would probably be better accomplished with working woofers.It will cost about $25 to $50 per driver to refoam the woofers. This is not a lot of money and in my opinion, it is well worth it to hear the speakers working properly. You will probably recoup this investment easily if you decide to sell them.Barry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bubbas_buddy Posted February 9, 2003 Report Share Posted February 9, 2003 Thanks for the suggestions Barry. I will replace the drivers and test as you suggest when I can. I recently spoke with a local speaker repair guy that has been in business for years. He did not appear to be excited about the prospect of restoring the speakers although he did give me an estimate of $30 each to repair the foam woofer surrounds. I could do it myself but it has taken me a year just to get around to inspecting the speakers. The speakers have been in my Dads basement for the last couple of years and one of the woofer cones has a light mildew growth. Any suggestions for cleaning that off the cone?Also, I have seen replacement woofers and mid drivers for sale for around $130 to $175 each. I am not willing to spend that kind of money up front on these speakers without knowing what they will sound like. Can these drivers be rebuilt if necessary?Bottom line is this. These speakers were headed for the trash pile. I think they deserve better than that, but I'm not willing to spend more cash on them than a nice pair of Heresy's or Cornwalls would cost.I appreciate everyone's suggestions/advice and I'm really looking forward to hearing these speakers. I oiled the cabinets and they look like half-a-million bucks alongside my Scott walnut cabbed integrated amp and tuner.Buddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bubbas_buddy Posted February 12, 2003 Report Share Posted February 12, 2003 Just in case someone here cares, one of the woofers needs surround only, the other reconing. Both mids are bad. Both hi range are good.I tested them by way of an AA battery. I thought surely someone here would suggest that.Although I've dropped in here from time to time over the last year or two, I haven't been a regular. Good thing. Either there are few AR fans here or they aren't very talkative. I found a source for all new drivers at a very good price. I will probably restore them.Buddy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 13, 2003 Report Share Posted February 13, 2003 Really unusual - don't think I've ever seen good tweeters and bad mids at the same time...the tweeters are usually the canary in the coal mine, and blow out before the midranges (or at least along with them). How were you able to evaluate the dome drivers with a DC voltage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 20, 2003 Report Share Posted February 20, 2003 >Although I've dropped in here from time to time over the last year or two, I haven't been a regular. Good thing. Either there are few AR fans here or they aren't very talkative. <Being new I can see how you might get that impression. I think your experience here has been skewed by circumstances beyond anyone's direct control.I wouldn't have said "test with a battery" because just popping with a volt and a half or nine really doesn't tell you much. As someone else said, I'm really surprised to hear that the midranges are bad and the tweeters are not. In fact, if it weren't for my fear you'd think I was implying something, I'd have said, "I find it hard to believe."As for replacing the woofer - well, there are a couple of schools of thought on that. Perfectionists will say, "Spider bad, speaker bad." The other side, particularly if you are only trying to hear them and not really restore them for your long-term pleasure, is that the driver is usually vertical so the spider isn't under a lot of pressure from gravity, so isn't starting-out bottomed, and usually sounds "alright" with functional foam surrounds.Of course, the mention of preferring Heresys to an AR11 didn't do anything to make AR fans want to talk to you, either. ;-)But that isn't my excuse. I've been away, then ill, then busy. Sorry I wasn't here to be more help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToastedAlmond Posted February 21, 2003 Report Share Posted February 21, 2003 There are plenty of talkative AR fans here. At least enough to say that if you like the way Heresy's and Cornwall's sound, you probably WON'T like the way the 11's sound. You're going to drive them with a tube amp? Those 11's eat roast beef for dinner, and thrive on power. The trash heap? NO! A loving home for them? YES! Toasted Almond Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 22, 2003 Report Share Posted February 22, 2003 >. At least enough to say that if you like the way Heresy's and Cornwall's sound, you probably WON'T like the way the 11's sound.<The only pair of Klipsh speakers I ever heard that I could stand were a pair of LaScalas (sp?). Sorta looked like a pair of horns that someone smushed flat. Mind you, I didn't ever want a pair, but they were seriously less offensive than the full-sized horns.Heresys? Not in my stable.Bret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bubbas_buddy Posted February 25, 2003 Report Share Posted February 25, 2003 Thanks for the comments, suggestions, and critisizmmmmms. None of which I asked for or really helps. Night and day difference here and the Klipsch forum.I bought some LaScalas. I'm going to take the AR's to the dump tomorrow. Funny how their fate coincides with the quality of help available here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 25, 2003 Report Share Posted February 25, 2003 No message Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
administrator Posted February 25, 2003 Report Share Posted February 25, 2003 This thread is now dead. Most people here know I am consistent with the policy that I am not going to put up with people trashing the forums.Anyway .. if you can't grasp that people volunteer their time here because this is their hobby, and not their job, I don't think anyone is all that interested in continuing the conversation. The sarcasm is lame.Fortunately this behavior is the exception rather than the rule.The original posters account is gone.Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
administrator Posted February 26, 2003 Report Share Posted February 26, 2003 Ok, the thread is not so dead .. The original poster emailed me and I am re-activating his account. See the thread below. Start from the bottom and read up for it to make sense. Thanks for taking your time to respond to my mail Mark. I understand your actions. I wish now that I had not been the cause of that action. Yes, I would appreciate you re-instating my account. You have my permission to post this conversation there if you believe it would have a positive effect for the Forum.I do know that there is a wealth of knowledge available at the site and the contributors there are what makes the Forum whatever it may be. I hope to contribute positively in the future.Thanks again.----- Original Message -----Subject: RE: banned from forumI appreciate you taking the time to write. The way I handle the forums is as soon as a flamefest begins to start, I kill it however I think will work quickest. I don't have much time to spend administering the forums and do not have any help to do it, so you can probably see why I have to deal with things this way. I think sometimes people do not realize this site is a hobby and has nothing to do with AR the company.Preferences are not something I think people in the forum care about, but the sarcastic stuff was about to set people off. Actually, someone did aggressively respond to your last post and I had to kill that message as well. My goal is to keep the forums informative in nature .. Before they existed I would frequently hit dead-ends when looking for schematics, advice, etc.If you want the account re-instated, let me know and I'll do so. I can also re-post this thread there to clear things up if you think it would be helpful.Mark SpencerWebmaster, The Classic Speaker Pages http://www.arsenal.net/speakers webmaster@arsenal.net-----Original Message-----To: webmaster@arsenal.netSubject: banned from forumHello Webmaster. Apparently I have been banned from this site. I have tried to log in so that I may e-mail the Administrator, Mark. Please forward this mail to Mark if you are able. Thanks.Mark, I wanted to publicly apologize for the off color comments that I posted in the Acoustic Research Forum but as you know I cannot access the site. There are no excuses for my comments, but I would like to say that those comments stemmed from my frustration in acquiring the information that I needed in the restoration of audio equipment that I hold in high regard. I wanted nothing more than to breath new life into my old pair of AR11's.I personally realize that sound is subjective. I am a Klipsch owner, among other brands. I am a member of the Klipsch Forum. I have never posted negative comments there regarding others preferences. In my posts on the AR Forum I did not say that I 'preferred' any speaker. So the comments there regarding Klipsch speakers along with the lack of information that I DID ask for caused a lapse in my good judgment. But that is no excuse. And I am sorry for having marred the results of your hard work. I enjoy the site and have read almost all of it. I know that I could have contributed.Good luck to you in the continued success of the site. It is quite enjoyable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r_laski Posted February 27, 2003 Report Share Posted February 27, 2003 Mark, THANK YOU for re-instating this thread. I am troubled by the thought of a beautiful pair of AR-11s sitting in a pile of rotting garbage. That would be incredibly unfortunate. I hope its not too late to save this pair of AR-11s from a dump site in Alabama. Although I have “lurked” on this forum since last fall, I never thought I had anything I could contribute to the discussions, until now. OpusX (Peter) is my brother and I’ve let him do the posting. I hope I can “mend some fences.” Buddy, I am the very proud original owner of a pair of AR-11s, (AR-11Bs SNs 19696 and 19697 – consecutive SNs!). I bought these in 1979 from a stereo shop in Oklahoma City for $500/pr as dealer demo/clearance. Early on, I had to replace both midranges and one woofer – warranty service of Teledyne was outstanding. I also purchased replacement foam grills from them a few years later when the originals began to disintegrate. In the early 90s, I had the “original” woofer reconed by a repair shop in Sacramento, CA – big mistake, all it needed was new foam surround. After several years of use, I put my AR-11s in storage in their original packing material and boxes. When my son went to college – Auburn, War Eagle – he took the AR-11s with him. He didn’t use them much. The AR-11s and his Sony receiver didn’t get along with each other very well. The Sony didn’t handle 4 ohm loads very well. Enough history. Like you, I am in the process of restoring my pair of AR-11s that have spent many years in storage. Coincidentally, I started about the same time you did. I removed the drivers to work on the cabinets. The “replacement” woofer needs a new foam surround. I’m not sure what I’m going to do with the reconed woofer. The shop (AR authorized) that did the reconing replaced the original dust cap with a huge “gaussy” dust cap that is very porous. I’ve learned from this forum that porous dust caps are wrong for an acoustic suspension speaker system. This dust cap is so large, the lead wires do not penetrate the cone anymore. My desire is to have it reconed again, by a competent repair shop, to original cone and dust cap shape and size or I’ll have to bite the bullet and get a replacement from Layne or AB Tech. I’m patiently waiting for Ken Kantor’s test results on Bret’s reconed woofers to see if reconing (again) is a worthwhile option. In your original post you stated, “I need suggestions that I can perform to determine if any of the drivers are good.” Bret and Barry recommended reinstalling the tweeters and midrange drivers in the cabinets and testing them. I understand your reluctance to hook your speakers up this way, but they gave you sound advice (pun intended). I reinstalled a tweeter and midrange in one of my AR-11 cabinets, unused for almost 8 years. I connected the AR-11 to my amp. Making sure the woofer leads were not touching anything, I powered up my system and played a CD to test just the midrange and tweeter. At first the sound was “tinny” and irritating. However, as my amp and the crossover caps warmed up, the sound improved tremendously. Result: tweeter and midrange tested good. I will be writing more about this test in a separate posting as I need help determining if I have a crossover cap problem manifesting itself by a continuous low level static noise coming from the drivers. But first I have to finish refinishing the cabinets using information I found in this forum. In one of your postings you stated, “Both mids are bad. Both hi range are good.” Although others have stated that their experience has been tweeters “blowing out” before or with midranges, the tweeters in my AR 11s are original. My mids also took a dirt nap independent of the tweeters, as did one woofer. I agree, it shouldn’t happen that way, but sometimes, very rarely, it does. The factory warranty replacement stickers on the back of both mids and one woofer remind me of what I have and have not replaced. You also stated that you “found a source for all new drivers at a very good price.” Would you care to share your source with the rest of us. From my Internet research and reading this forum, Sources for AR replacement drivers are pretty much limited to Layne, AB Tech, and taking your chances on eBay. If you have found another source, we might all benefit. If your source only had a single set / pair of drivers, at least you had the good fortune of getting new drivers at a good price. Did your good fortune include woofers? If so, I hope you did not throw out the original woofers. These are very repairable and I’m certain there is interest in them by many in this forum, or on eBay. About your non-working mid ranges. If you still have them, I believe most here will agree that they are not repairable, or at least it is not cost effective. However, I may have a use for them. Several years ago, I did an incredibly stupid thing and removed the wire cages from the midranges of my AR–11s. I can’t tell you all how much I regret doing it now that I learned about things like speaker cabinet diffraction. If the wire cages on your non-working midranges are in good shape, I am interested in them just so I can restore my working midranges back to original configuration. About your AR-11s. If you still have them and want to complete the restoration we are all here to help in any way we can. If you still have them and just want to get rid of them, for whatever reason, I live in Atlanta, and am willing to drive to any address in Alabama to adopt them into a loving home. (In other words, I’ll buy them from you for a fair price and come and pick them up). Lastly, besides classic AR speakers, I also like the classic Klipsch speakers. Although I’ve never had the pleasure of owning any, I’m somewhat familiar with them and have listened to them enough to know that, in their own way, they are also great speakers. Very efficient, due to their horn loading, and maybe better suited to tube equipment than AR speakers. Although the AR-11s will work quite nicely with tube amps, as was alluded to, they need more power than you feed to your Klipsch speakers to really sing. Not knowing the output capability of your tube amp, this may or may not be an issue. Anyone can explain this in more technical terms than I’m going to, but, when you compare a speaker like the Heresy to speakers like the AR-11s, as I did back in the 70s, at low volume levels the higher efficiency of the Heresy’s makes them sound better. As you increase the power to the AR-11s, at some point they will start to come alive. Only when you match the output of the speakers, not the power input to them, can you make a valid and honest evaluation of one speaker versus another. Of course, the evaluation would have to be done blindfolded to eliminate preconceived preferential bias toward one speaker over the other. From what I remember, I think you will find the Heresy’s and the AR-11s, at equal output, both sound very good, more similar than different to each other in a lot of ways. And, IMHO, both sound better than Advents of the same era.Rich Laski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
administrator Posted February 27, 2003 Report Share Posted February 27, 2003 Hi Rich,I just put some carriage returns in your message to make it easier to read .. Thanks for posting!Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 27, 2003 Report Share Posted February 27, 2003 >My mids also took a dirt nap independent of the tweeters, as did one woofer. <That is sooooo odd. The woofers always "die" of old age, but honestly I have never, ever, seen the midranges die and leave the tweeters intact. Do you have any recollection of what might have killed them off? Did an audio signal generator or maybe a component gone bad contribute?MAYbe this is a "feature" of the AR11?As for the Heresy vs AR11 sound test - I don't have any A/B experience with the two, but I suspect this would be a lot like any A/B of an AR and any inherently brighter speaker; the Heresy would sound MUCH better for about 10-20 minutes.Something that I find strange enough for it to almost annoy me about the "old" AR speakers is that my hearing seems to improve the longer I listen to them. That is to say, the detail seems to reveal itself slowly, but naturally. To really appreciate them for what they do, it almost requires extended listening. Fortunately, that's an easy thing to do with AR speakers.There is an exception, of course, "Bloody Well Right" from Supertramp, at volume, on a pair of well-driven AR9s. The impact there is rather immediate. ;-)Bret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest OpusX Posted February 28, 2003 Report Share Posted February 28, 2003 To add my two cents to the discussion....wrote a response over a week ago, but couldn't post because it it took me longer than 30 minutes to compose so I timed out. Anyway, to add to what my brother eloquently said - 'Let Those Speakers Live'. Of course, we are all a little biased here, but for any of us who have sat down and listened to the AR-11s for any length of time realize that they really are worth saving if it is feasible and within reason economically. Like my brother, I too have a set of AR-11s that I purchased while overseas in 1978. They were a wonderful step up from my AR-MSTs (Still have packed away in the original box and packing material) and served me well over the years. Recently put them away when I acquired a set of AR-90s. As you stated in your first post, you wondered if the sound you were going to hear when you got those speakers restored was going to be worth the time and money. I don't think that you are going to be disappointed. And as Brett pointed out, it may take you a bit to really hear the things that make those speakers worth the effort. They aren't going to be AR-LSTs (Richard take care of mine for a few months longer - yeah.... I'm the guy that got that incredible deal on eBay a couple of months ago - and ask Rick how they sound) and they won't be AR-9s (hopefully another addition to my collection in a few days in a private sale), but they will serve you well with hours of great sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bubbas_buddy Posted February 28, 2003 Report Share Posted February 28, 2003 Rich, thanks for the generous reply. Rest assured that the speakers are still here. If I do not/can not repair them, I will contact you.I tested the drivers in cabinet with a receiver, with a DC battery, and with a multimeter. All negative results on the mids and one woofer. I was and still am interested in any other ideas. I talked with Bill Miller and he wasn't very thrilled about the odds of the mids being any good or repairable. You should talk to Bill about your woofers, if you haven't already (215-412-0542 MillerSoundLabs). I have original hi range drivers, one warranty replacement mid/one original, both woofers original. The 'eyeball' mids (foam appears white-second generation?) appear as new. The hi range drivers have almost all the foam intact on their face. The woofers have the screen wire on the back of the baskets.The best prices I have found in my limited search is from ABTech. Alex quoted these prices if I purchased multi drivers. Woofers/$89.00 each, mids/ $61.95 each, hi's/ $38.60 each. I would like to know if these are exact matches/replacements for originals. I am interested only in hearing how the AR11's were meant to sound. For entertainment purposes you might check out www.simplyspeakers.com down in Fla.Because of work I have very limited time. My original intention was to use my Scott 222-C tube amp with a pair of Klipsch speakers to listen to my ~500 or so LP's. Their high efficiency will work well with the 22WPC integrated amp. The Klipsch sound runs from warm to forward and varies with SS or tube amplification. I have no alliegance to any brand. I listen.The AR11's (b's) have been in my Dad's basement for many years. He records there. He has been holding on to them at my request and recently went on a cleaning binge. He called and said they had to go, so I picked them up. So here we are. I have a great appreciation for old audio equipment. It is frustrating to be put in the position of having to decide whether to trash/not trash something of high quality such as the AR11's. It may take awhile, but if I cannot/ do not repair them I will get in touch with you.Thanks again for the post. It was what I came here looking for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bubbas_buddy Posted February 28, 2003 Report Share Posted February 28, 2003 One more thing Rich. Do your AR11's have the original badges? As stated earlier, one of mine has a solid brass AR11 badge, the other what appears to be an aluminum AR11 badge that is black. What badges do yours have, if any? I'm wondering which is original. Do you have an 'Owner's Instruction Manual'?I have two SS amps that can drive the AR11's. Both Acurus. One 100X3 and the other 125X5. One of those should work.Another thing. I know a guy that has ties to AR from the seventies. I've got to contact him to see if he can help. If he can offer any help, I'll let you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tysontom Posted March 1, 2003 Report Share Posted March 1, 2003 >>One more thing Rich. Do your AR11's have the original badges?>As stated earlier, one of mine has a solid brass AR11 badge,>the other what appears to be an aluminum AR11 badge that is>black. What badges do yours have, if any? I'm wondering which>is original. Do you have an 'Owner's Instruction Manual'?>Both badges are original. The brass logo plate was shipped with the original-issue ("Advanced Development Division") AR-11's and AR-10Pi's; later, approximately 1978 or so, AR went to a black-aluminum badge with silver lettering. It is possible that one of the original badges got lost and a replacement was sent in the aluminum material, or the speakers were of different vintage.>I have two SS amps that can drive the AR11's. Both Acurus. One>100X3 and the other 125X5. One of those should work.>One reason the AR-11 is hard to drive is the low impedance. Although it is a "4-ohm" speaker, the impedance actually dips significantly below that down into the 2-ohm area over part of the spectrum, and this can present a challenging load to many solid-state amplifiers. Tube amps need not apply (unless they are high-powered 6550 designs). Also, the AR-11 has relatively low sensitivity (inefficient), and the tendancy is for one to elevate the power because of its clean output. As such, amplifiers without sufficient reserve -- or the capability to operate into low impedances -- can get into trouble quickly. It is also for this reason that midrange drivers can be susceptible to burnout. The tweeters are ferro-fluid cooled, and seem able to take a lot of power (compared to the earlier AR-3a-type dome).--Tom Tyson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 1, 2003 Report Share Posted March 1, 2003 >Alex quoted these prices if I purchased multi drivers. Woofers/$89.00 each, mids/ $61.95 each, hi's/ $38.60 each. <Alex is being good to you. I recently paid about $125 each for four 12" woofers from ABTech. Mids - be careful with these mids and ABTech. A friend and I recently did to 10pi's what you are doing to 11's. Alex sent one pair of midranges that wouldn't fit in the cabinet (no screen, no eyeball) and a second set from a 9-series speaker with aluminum rings which fit but were a poor sonic match for the originals and completely changed the imaging characteristics. I would insist on the original part number if I were going to deal with Alex on these.At Simply Speakers I found these midranges and called to confirm that they had screens and eyeballs and everything. They said they were NOS, but I have my doubts. They are expensive. Your mileage may vary.http://www.simplyspeakers.com/12diaphragms.htmThe woofers offered by ABTech are NOT the same as the original woofers. If you have a ruined woofer, however, I'm not sure you have much of an option. The screen on the back to keep the stuffing off the cone is not on the new drivers and the frames are different and the spiders look thinner.There is a man in PA who will rebuilt that 12" driver almost to your specs (new, broken-in, whatever) but he's expensive and as slow as everyone else. (I've sent drivers to Simply Speakers, Layne, and this guy in PA and two months later I have no drivers.)My experience with the new ones is that they are adequate but need an extended break-in period. Remember, however, that I'm using them in AR9s where they are crossed-over so low that whatever their upper range characteristics, I'm not hearing them. In the friend's 10pi, although perfectly adequate, I think I am missing some low-end extension. I cannot prove that, it may be his room/placement, it may be that they aren't completely broken-in yet. It may be my imagination.I currently have six of the 12" drivers being refoamed and/or rebuilt. If you are very patient you might get a couple of rebuilt drivers out of the 10pi's from me, or some replacements that are at least partially broken-in.Oh, one other thing - the replacement 12" drivers for my AR9's were purchased about 6-8 weeks after the replacement 12" drivers were bought for the 10pi's. They aren't the same. They all came from ABTech, but evidently ABTech has more than one source; or their one source switched parts.The tweeter sold at Simply Speakers either isn't NOS or not as old as the AR11 line of drivers. I can't say what they might sound like. I would be tempted to go with ABTech or Layne on those. I haven't had to buy any new ones, yet, so I can't be as much help with those.Bret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 1, 2003 Report Share Posted March 1, 2003 >As such, amplifiers without sufficient reserve -- or the capability to operate into low impedances -- can get into trouble quickly. <If I can talk about the 11's based on my recent experience with the 10pi's (if it applies); a Yamaha low-impedance tolerant receiver at 65w/channel didn't even come CLOSE to being able to drive them. Likewise, an 80w/channel Sansui (same vintage as the speakers) wasn't up to the task. We popped a fuse on the 10pi with the Yamaha just at the point it was going into obvious compression.The Threshhold A400, SAE 502A, and Adcom 555MkII all did very nicely into that strange 4ohm (anyone know the ascii code for an omega?) load, however.They were very 1-D and flat without those big power supplies in those big amplifiers.Bret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 1, 2003 Report Share Posted March 1, 2003 Oh, another thing about replacement drivers.Luigi Fedele (knows a lot) once said - "As far as I know the tweeter #1210084-0 is the replacement part only for AR 3a and LST. AR 10 Pi and 11 used the 1200011-1."I'm certain he's right.Yet - Layne at speakersupply.com (Stephen Tidwell) has one .75" tweeter fitting in all the above listed models and that's the same story as at Simply Speakers.This also from Luigi, "Perhaps the production of the ones labelled 1210010-1A has stopped and the midranges you have are the "right" ones.In any case ask http://www.speakersupply.com/ maybe they Know samething more. You can also try at http://www.dynavox.ch/default.htm (its E-mail is: info@dynavox.ch). They distribute speakers marked ROWEN that use (or used)the same tweeters and midranges as AR 10 Pi. Maybe they still have replacement units labelled 200010-1 or 1210010-1A. If you should try to buy them on Ebay, be carefull becouse even though a speaker sounds that does not guarantee that it is ok. You should also mesure its DC resistance at least. DC resistance of AR 10 Pi midrange is about 3.7 ohm."I emailed and got the following reply:"Dear Mr. Thiel The midranges 1210010 are still available for CHF 240.- each excluding transport. Please, let us know for which AR modell you need them. Best regards Yvo Aebischer DYNAVOX electronics S.A. Rte André-Piller 21 CH 1762 Givisiez "The reason I'm quoting all that is to point-out that AR used different drivers in the different speakers and labelled them as such. Most of the replacement guys seem to offer a one-driver-fits-all solution. I have no idea if the speakers referenced above are the same as Layne and ABTech but bear a different sticker, although I doubt it.BUT - I have to say that Stephen at Layne sometimes has things that aren't on the website and might be worth calling to see if he has what you are looking for.In the meantime, I'd really like to know the numbers are on the backs of the drivers you have.Bret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 2, 2003 Report Share Posted March 2, 2003 >I would like to know if these are exact matches/replacements for originals.<I found this listing you might be interested in if this number is right for your 11's (I believe it is):http://www.audioclassics.com/detail.php3?d...2000101&nav=catA little higher than ABTech, but then again, this looks to be the correct driver.Bret Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.