AR 90 first time listen and amplifier pairing question

[DavidR]

No; I don't believe that is correct John. The AR90 schematic has the woofers red wires going to POS at the woofer AND at the binding post. That would be in-phase.

Take another look. You will see the U bend in the line crossing the NEG wire near the speaker jacks/binding posts. That means it is not connected to the NEG wire.

[johnfalc]

DavidR - Start at the "-" terminal and follow the circuit and see that it leads to the "*" (dotted) terminal on all three upper speakers.  Then follow from the same "-" terminal down and see that the circuit leads directly to the woofer terminals WITHOUT the dots.  Either that or we're looking at different schematic diagrams.  John

[Stimpy]

Per the AR schematics, the upper drivers of the 9, are in phase with it's woofers.  The 90s are opposite; the upper drivers are out of phase to their woofers.  I wonder if this is due to the height differences between the 2 speakers?  The taller AR9 presents the upper drivers in a bass peak, so those drivers are in phase to one another.  The upper drivers, of the shorter 90s, fall into a bass null, so they require the out of phase wiring, to match and balance to one another?

[DavidR]

This was the best trace job I could do on my laptop.

The dotted lines are merely the upper and lower boards and what is located on them.

In the pic of the lower board you can see the red wires and the coil hooked to one side of the cap. Follow the coil to the other side and you will see the >> and where it changes to a white wire. It is not the same white wire as that used on the LMR and they are not connected. Its beyond me why AR didn't continue with red. In the 2nd pic, the upper board, you will see that woofer/white wire is hooked to the POS terminal. ALL others are hooked to the NEG side and all those are for the other drivers (but not the woofers).

 

 

 

[DavidR]

Attached schematic by R. Lowe who did a GREAT job.

ar90 xoverschematic.pdf

[Stimpy]

3 minutes ago, DavidR said:

Attached schematic by R. Lowe who did a GREAT job.

ar90 xoverschematic.pdf 54.75 kB · 1 download

Thanks for that.  I agree, "a great job", and I never knew who authored it.

[DavidR]

1 hour ago, Stimpy said:

Per the AR schematics, the upper drivers of the 9, are in phase with it's woofers.  The 90s are opposite; the upper drivers are out of phase to their woofers. 

Correct. The rest is speculation and your guess as to why is as good as mine (a few posts back).

[johnfalc]

Ah - then we are in agreement. 

[DavidR]

47 minutes ago, johnfalc said:

Ah - then we are in agreement. 

I don't believe that's what you wrote. You wrote that the 90 drivers were ALL out-of-phase.

- not amused -

[DavidR]

On 1/13/2023 at 2:17 PM, johnfalc said:

woofers out of phase

and you repeatedly told me I was wrong in what I wrote

[johnfalc]

22 hours ago, DavidR said:

and you repeatedly told me I was wrong in what I wrote

I'm sorry there's been communication failure here.  All I ever said was that the woofers of the 90 are out of phase with the other three drivers, whereas the woofers of the 9 are in phase with the other three drivers.  I then linked to drawings in the library here which show this to be the case.  I never said "you are wrong" ... all I did was post information that supported what I (and others on this thread) had stated re the difference between the arrangement of the 90s and the 9s.  Let's just enjoy the speakers.

[DavidR]

8 hours ago, johnfalc said:

I'm sorry there's been communication failure here.  All I ever said was that the woofers of the 90 are out of phase with the other three drivers, whereas the woofers of the 9 are in phase with the other three drivers.  I then linked to drawings in the library here which show this to be the case.  I never said "you are wrong" ... all I did was post information that supported what I (and others on this thread) had stated re the difference between the arrangement of the 90s and the 9s.  Let's just enjoy the speakers.

I read thru all the posts again. The OP reported lack of bass. Issue was a speaker wire to the binding post was reversed (if I read it right - its late). Another member suggested the 90 was like the 9 and to make sure all connections were wired in-phase. I do disagree with that. A third member mentioned lack of bass and a possibility they were mis-wired (on the woofers if I'm reading it correctly) when he got them. He reversed them and reported good bass. I posted a reminder as to how the 90s are wired.

About 3 years ago a member noted his surround system was indicating the 90s were out-of-phase. I posted that the tweeter, UMR and LMR are indeed wired out-of-phase but the woofers are wired in-phase. I did not deviate from that in this thread or any other post/thread.  When you say "the woofers of the 90 are out of phase with the other three drivers" its very misleading and IMO not correctly worded as the 'other 3 drivers' are the ones wired out-of-phase. This means the POS side of the driver is wired to the NEG side of crossover and ultimately the NEG speaker wire from the amp.

So I'm miffed as to your statement. One of my pet peeves is wasting time; but I'm over it.